Episode 63 - Cheryl Rickman
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Introduction to Permission to be Human
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Mel: Welcome to Permission to be Human, the podcast. I'm your host Mel Findlater mother, coach, and curator of Permission to be Human, the company and community. If you're a mom, know a mom, or want to be a mom, and you crave getting out in the world to make a difference, then you're in the right place. This is a space for moms like you to connect with yourself, your purpose, and your big audacious dreams.
Because when you feel your best, you can better you, your family, and the wider world. Let's do this.
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We have Cheryl Rickman with us today. Cheryl's an author and ghost writer having written 27 books including works on positive psychology and more. She writes books to help people fret less and flourish more. And helps bring out the book in wellbeing, experts, TV, sports, personalities. And business leaders who don't [00:01:00] have the time to write their own manuscript. Now I find the career of being an author and ghost author to be absolutely fascinating. So I had to have Cheryl come on to the show. And tell us about her story.
How raising a daughter whilst writing has worked for her and her passion. For positive psychology and nature. If you've listened to this podcast for long enough, you may realize that I believe in the power of nature. And so does Cheryl. So I'm really excited about her. Newest book, tree glee, and it's sitting on my bookshelf right now. Ready for me to dig in. And I think I'll do it alongside my daughter, who also loves trees in all of their forums. So if writing a book has intrigued you or.
The conversation around what it's like to follow. And pursue [00:02:00] that dream and so much more. Then stick around.
Mel: Hi, Cheryl. It's so nice to have you on here and chatting again. We haven't spoken in, I actually, I don't even know, six years, probably. Yeah. I
Cheryl: mean, yeah, it's going to be, it time just goes so quickly. It's so crazy, but yeah, it's yeah, it's been a long time that we haven't had them touch base and we've seen each other what's going on in each other's worlds on social media and stuff, but yeah, not.
So
Mel: I'm really excited to, to do that and find out more about what you've been up to because you know the tidbits that I've seen in between when we saw each other last and now really they're in sync with a lot of what we talked about on this podcast as well as just my own life and experiences.
and learnings within nature, especially in the last while, so I'm excited about that. You [00:03:00] and I met at Camp Good Life Project, which I actually did an episode about that experience not that long ago, because I was It was my first time away from my daughter, actually, when I went to camp. So I lived in England.
We both did at the time. And, we went, so that was my first week. I think I was away for like nine days in the end or something in order to make it all work, which in New York, right? Like it was pretty crazy. The flights got all crazy for me, but yeah, it was such a beautiful experience. And I feel like anybody I would meet at an adult summer camp is the right kind of person to me.
I love summer camps. So,
Cheryl: yeah, definitely. It was one of those things where the synergies of everyone really, it was just really powerful. But yeah, it's hard when the first time you ever go away from your child. I remember doing that for a writing project and [00:04:00] yeah, it was really difficult.
Mel: Yeah, it's really difficult and also so needed, right?
Like for me it was, I think she was about two and a half at the time and it was, when I think back, like that was a big transition in our life at that point. I was actually pregnant, only like two months pregnant, three months pregnant at that point in time, I think, with my second and nobody really knew about that.
And I was kind of, yeah, navigating that world. We stopped breastfeeding by me leaving. And it was just, there was like, that was a big transition in my life. So but what a cool place to go to, to have those. Yeah.
Cheryl: I mean, of all the places you could have gone, like a safe, a soft place to land with like minded people yeah.
Mel: Yeah, for sure. So tell us about you. Who's, who's Cheryl? Yeah, big, the biggest
Cheryl: question. Tell us about you.
Cheryl's Journey and Positive Psychology
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Cheryl: Oh well, I guess, [00:05:00] yeah, I mean, I'm, going to be 50 this year. So I'm, kind of looking forward, looking forward to that in terms of it's, it feels like it's the afternoon of my life. So I guess.
Saying who I, who I'm, would be sort of yeah. Explaining what I've done in the, the first, the morning of my life. And I guess I'm somebody who from, from a, grew up in a small village called Far Oak and Southern England, only child of mom and dad. And yeah, just, I've always been very I guess I'm a very hopeful, kind of optimistic.
enthusiast, kind of, I guess, yeah, enthusiastic person would be how I'd describe myself. But what I do for a living is [00:06:00] I am an author/ghost writer, which I've been doing for since 2005, so 18 years. And also positive psychology practitioner in terms of, like you Mel, we both I do dare. Amelia's, student of that, but I think it was the first cohort that was a sort of international cohort back in 2016, I think it was.
So yeah, so that's, that's always inspired me. And I think who I am is very much, obviously you're shaped by your experiences, aren't you? So I think I had a very positive, very optimistic mum, but she was physically disabled. She had MS. But you she let that sort of stop her in [00:07:00] many ways and she was a medical physics technician and, and really smart, beautiful woman, very encouraging amazing mum.
And then my dad, like amazing, really nice, kind guy who was, but he did struggle mentally. So he wasn't sort of, so maybe optimistic and sort of looked at the past, so kind of maybe a bit more victim mindset, so I guess I'm kind of more like my mum, but I found positive psychology as a really interesting, type of psychology of instead of, focusing on what's wrong and getting people to neutral looking north of neutral and very interested in the dynamic with my mum and dad and their differences.
And yeah, I think. Just in terms of your question, who am I? And the, the [00:08:00] podcast itself and the topics of helping moms to build, build their dreams.
Navigating Life's Transitions
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Cheryl: I think having, having my parents and then actually losing my mom when I was 17, so she was 43, so that's weird that I'm older than older than her.
Yeah, just, just having had that experience I think has shaped me because obviously, yeah, you don't, it's very difficult to be a mum without a mum and obviously live from being a teenager to where you are now without her. But, it's also made me realise how important life, every second of life is.
I knew I wanted to do something in my life that would in my working life that would help people make the most of their lives, so [00:09:00] whether that's through the books I write or workshops I've given, yeah, in some way, if I can help people, the tools to help them make the most of life, then that's kind of my, my main aim with the, with the projects I take on, so.
Yeah, there we go. A long answer to your question, but yeah, that is a big question,
Mel: so it's allowed to have a long answer, I figure, right? It's always interesting, everybody answers it very differently, and there's no right or wrong way, and I think you really touched on, A few different parts of yourself there, right?
There's the positive psychology aspect of it there's the optimist view of the world, and there's that strong desire, like a lot of the listeners that we have here, to really, I think you said it as, help people make the most of life. Right? Like, I think we, I think that's beautiful. [00:10:00] And to have that from such a young age, I was just checking out your, your website briefie before we talked.
And I think it said something like you knew from a young age what you wanted to do. And you knew you wanted to somewhere, somewhere in that phrase, like make a difference somehow. I think there were slightly different words, but, and you wanted to write books. So there's a few labels that maybe you missed off, not that that's who you are, but I'm curious if we just throw them out there to help people get a context of what, what life looks like for you, such as author so I think you said ghostwriter and I'm very interested to dig into that actually in a second, but, author and, and mother, right?
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Cheryl: And also. It's funny, I did I knew I wanted to, to write books ideally, but I think, it was, I was quite, I did a very vague kind of media [00:11:00] degree that I wasn't quite 100 percent sure I was going to be writing. But yeah, writing books under my own name and also writing for other people.
So who don't have the time or the capability or whatever it is to, to write their own books. But I've, I started off my career doing business books and, but, but wanted to make it easy to digest. So I'd sort of did the small business startup work, but which was very much kind of aimed at really was aimed at mums or, or I noticed that business books were just very kind of dry, kind of.
Cash flow just it weren't very inspirational and, and practical to busy, busy people. So it's kind of, I feel like I targeted a lot of my target audience has been, [00:12:00] women and and, and sometimes obviously mums as well. Written a bit called You Are Enough, which is about as we all, getting rid of those shackles of should, that the society gives us.
So, yeah, I've I've written quite a lot of books. I think it's 27 books, but that does include the ones I've just written. And, yeah. Yeah, I, I've got them on my bookshelf behind me, but, yeah, I try and, try and kind of blend inspiration and information. So trying people's stories or my story or whatever, but it's often been about sort of resilience or flourishing.
The first, first book I ever wrote the first self help book, should I say, that I ever wrote was called The Flourish Handbook, which has. Recently, it's been changed to You Can [00:13:00] Flourish because I self published that book, and then a publisher actually said, oh, well, we'd like to, when we publish it, which it's brilliant to hear, and, but we, we, we changed it and I rewrote a lot of it, with the knowledge, because I wrote it before I did positive psychology the qualification, so I 2013 and, Yeah.
Yeah. Then it's, it got published a decade later, so
So that was nice to see that come full Paula. Yeah. And obviously I think 2013, so I think my daughter will, she was born in 2008. Yeah, so she was five. And that, I think sometimes it's quite nice to look back at the books you've written or the things you've done, the projects you've worked on, and remember what was going on in your life at those.
And what was very interesting to anybody who's interested in positive [00:14:00] psychology, was that I wrote, I started to write the Flourish handbook, which yeah, now I'm not so available it's UCL Flourish. But it was a year, but I didn't know at the time because my dad was just fine and he was going around the world on cruise ships.
as a dance host. And but he got diagnosed with Nesliheliuma, which is like a asbestos related cancer. And so as I was literally pulling it together and going to the last pages, but what would be interesting to, to your listeners, I think is how much of what I'd written in the book about flourishing, how these pillars of wellbeing were helping me navigate.
What I was then going through and so I was writing a chapter on supportive relationships being really important. And then [00:15:00] my friends would rock up with a lasagna because they knew that I was driving up and down the motorway. To, to visit my dad in the, who brought him to a hospice and it was very short from diagnosis to when he passed away.
It was literally three weeks. It was just really kind of very quick. All of these tools that I'd been writing about. really helped me. So I think it was really interesting. I think the positive emotion that we speak about in positive psychology, the need for gratitude and love and all these positive emotions, I feel like my mum had equipped me with things that were part of who I'd become, and it really helped me navigate and bounce back quicker than perhaps I might have done had I not had those sort of that, that positivity.
Yeah, so it was, it was very interesting these that what [00:16:00] I was writing about was actually, I then didn't expect to have to use, but I had to then use them in my own life to help me, yeah, navigate that difficult, difficult time. And yeah, I guess that's, that's what I want to help other people do with the projects I work on now.
And yeah, of course, Mum, very important label, losing my mum, I think I just knew, yeah, one day I really wanted to be a mum. And I feel very grateful that I get to have the mother daughter relationship the other way round. I think I do overcompensate sometimes because, I sort of, I do share a lot about my daughter in our escapades, and I kind of, yeah, we're really close with, she's 15, she's just about to start her GCSEs tomorrow, in fact, her exams start, [00:17:00] and she's very excited because it means that she's that much closer to actually never having to go to school.
So she's like, yes, it's, the end is near, but before she goes to college and stuff, but, yeah, it's, It's, it's just, I, I, I'm, I'm really wanting to cultivate a really close relationship, which I'm really grateful that I've been able to do with with her, and yeah, it's, it's one of the best, best jobs in the world and also hugely challenging sometimes, but yeah, it's, it's made, it's a very important part of who I am, Yeah, very grateful that I get to, get to use her name.
Mel: Yeah, that's beautiful. And I think you really touch on there of like, all these things that we learn, these, on our journey in being [00:18:00] human, right? And the intentional learning that you've gone out and, And had around positive psychology and even before you, you called it that, right? Some people listening might not even know what I'm talking, what we're like, what is positive psychology, right?
They might have no idea. And there's some simple answers to that. But the, the most simple being what I think you mentioned the phrase going from neutral to up essentially to flourish. Yeah. But my point being before you even took that qualification your intention was to, to, you wrote, you wrote the book, right?
Like, so this is obviously the topic that lights you up and that kind of intrigues you as you go forth in life. And it's clear that that's come in in different kind of points in your life as a support mechanism for you too. Yeah.
Cheryl: Yeah, absolutely. And it's, it's been really good. I did, [00:19:00] I stopped doing it.
The Power of Nature and Self-Care
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Cheryl: It's also important to with permission to be human to, to know when to say no, or when something's not, but I did for six years, I did something called the flourish weekend where I think it was like 40 women, mostly mums. In the end of January I think everybody's so tired because they've got through Christmas at the end of, and then January's all night kind of new year, new you all of all these good inventions and then we're getting to the end of it and it's February and, so I thought that's a really good time to do a little flourishy thing and we'd go off to this.
A hotel near a beach in former South England. Mm-Hmm. . And just having some me time and, I think that's one of the most important, parts of, aside from [00:20:00] nurturing and nourishing and encouraging your own child and doing what you would think makes makes a mother. self care and having that me time.
Wow, that's so important. I think if I hadn't and where you are juggling all the plates and it's so hectic and, and then also, just a little aside, then when your child is a teenager and going through all kinds of hormonal stuff is exactly the same time, roughly, depending when you're also going through hormonal stuff, there's menopause or perimenopause, depending.
kicks in. So it can be like really bad. So yeah, self care. So having that time away, and I, we would do a bit of art and a bit of we'd have treatments. So we'd have massages and all that. And then, I would talk about, what, what flourishing is and how, [00:21:00] how to kind of, Create sort of sustainable well being, and yeah, just to incorporate certain things into daily life that are doable and achievable, and make you feel good, but also then the knock on effect on your family, is, yeah, obviously really important.
So, yeah, I've enjoyed, enjoyed sort of implementing the. the tools that I talk about and, you know, practicing what I preach, I guess.
Mel: That's brilliant. And I, I love that. I love that you've done these retreats essentially for women to go and take that space so often we're like, how do, like, what do you mean take space?
You keep telling me that. And like, [00:22:00] yes, there's everyday little ways we can take space. And those are super important and almost more important, but also the ability to be in community, taking space. is really, really important.
Cheryl: Yeah. And, and now I find, so for me, what that looks like is it could be anything from going for a sound bath, or some doing an activity that's really relaxing with a friend.
So, then we are going to have a catch up afterwards so it's kind of like tasks. Tannis Frayne, who's also on Good Life went to Camp Good Life, who talks about synergy tasking, so sort of going like, I've got this, this, and this to walk the dog, go to the post office. And, I really need to see so and so, I haven't seen them for ages, and, I need to get some coffee, [00:23:00] and so, and then just going, right, well, let's do it all together, or I'll go and get my friend, and we'll go and walk the dog together, and we'll go to the post office on route, and then we can have a good chat and catch up.
So it's kind of like figuring out what you've got to do and can't, I love
Mel: that because as mothers, especially, we have so many little tasks that it's just like the mother load is real, right? And you're able to release some of that by actually doing some of the work, but you're getting the positive benefits of that community feeling, that relationship, that connection.
And, Yeah. I love that. Another example of doing that, which I've never really given a name to, but I have a friend who, mostly is a virtual friend. We haven't eventually met in person now, but we, we just have WhatsApp and we'll voice message to each other constantly. Right? And then when we meet up, [00:24:00] we always have a walk and talk and we're always walking our dog.
Right? When she has a dog because she's not always with it, but, but my dog, I'm like, yeah, we're going for a walk with a dog because I know I need to get that done today and it feels so good. We're outside all those things. But yeah, it's, it's, we've been trained and it's ingrained in our brain to feel good when we accomplish things.
So why not, like, do it all together? And it's okay not to accomplish things when you're enjoying self care. But it's nice to have that combination. Those are, yeah.
Cheryl: Yeah. And, and also I'd love the, I was like very animated when you said about the WhatsApp voice notes, because I just find, so I've got two friends in Canada, well, a bunch of friends in Canada, but a couple that I catch up with via voice note.
So I'll leave them a voice note and then she'll listen, take notes. And reply to my voicemail and you feel really seen and heard because there, there's no interruption. You're like, you're listened to fully, like the fact [00:25:00] that my friend Eva makes notes and I've got another friend, Debra Dean Kirby. We have a call, we have a group call and yeah, we just feel really, really seen and heard.
So having that space. So that's a form of self care and connection, but also, also nature. And that's. I found really, yeah, just we moved to the countryside, five years ago. And so obviously, yeah, just having that much more space, is great. But even, even in the city, just there's, there's plenty of trees and that's great.
Well, I ended up writing, The Tree Glee, which is all about how how and why trees make us feel better. And it was really fascinating to, to uncover all the actual science and the, the evidence about how, just, [00:26:00] just things like the essential oils that trees release, the phytoncides, are, they, they help boost your immune system when you breathe them in, so they make you physically feel better.
But the, they can have sort of a similar impact to like positive emotion of opening your brain to, so you can think clearer. So, so you can have more clarity and stuff. So going for a walk, I mean, I always feel better after going for a walk. If I've had a, I've had an argument or I just am feeling a bit meh, I'll just take myself off for a walk and that, in nature, I always, I never feel worse, I always guarantee I feel better.
And usually I come up with some really good ideas for, whether it's book ideas or how I'm going to navigate something. So yeah, I'm definitely an advocate for [00:27:00] kind of nature therapy. Yeah.
Mel: Yeah, me as well.
Cheryl: And
Mel: that's amazing.
The Importance of Noticing and Gratitude
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Mel: It's really interesting, like, The phrase that always comes to my mind is noticing nature it's not so much about whether we just get out in it, it's about what do we notice while we're out there, right?
And when we moved back from the UK to Canada, so we were in the UK for 14 years, and then we moved back to Vancouver Island, which I hadn't been since, well, I'd visited, but I hadn't lived here since university days. Right. So it's been a while. I didn't notice nature in university, other than the bunnies on my university site.
There was a lot of bunnies and that's pretty much why I chose to go there. But but also, now I notice, I notice the trees cause it is gorgeous here. Right. And I'm just like, how did I not notice this before? Right. But it is what we see. What we choose to notice, we then notice more, right? And I [00:28:00] notice the trees.
This year, I'm starting to notice, someone pointed out to me last spring, the maple flowers on a maple tree. I've never noticed that a maple tree has maple flowers before, and you can actually eat them. And in, in like a certain phase of it. And this year, all I can see is maple flowers. Right? And I'm like, Oh, when are they going to stop being flowers and turn into seed pods?
And like, my brain is just going all curious, right? But I would have never, maple trees were just maple trees before they had the like fingered type leaves on them and they're beautiful and they change color, that's, but there's always this like next level of depth that. That our brain can start to notice once we, once we let it.
Cheryl: It's huge noticing, having that curiosity. It does two things. It kind of, like you say, you notice it more that appears, the good stuff, but it, it does, it makes you just more open and curious. And also [00:29:00] gratitude. I find it's a route to gratitude, which we all know is, massively important part of the way to flourish.
And the more you are grateful for, the more you end up having to be grateful for because, and just things like replacing, I, I have to do this. Oh, I've got to do this with, I get to I get to, I get to take my child to school, which means I get to have that conversation I wouldn't have had, or instead of, oh, I've got to take them to school.
So yeah, so that, but within nature, when you notice the, like the other day, we had, you'll, you'll know because you lived in England for so long, rain, just constantly. Now, this is the first week that I can remember, since the beginning of spring, definitely. Where we've had sunshine for maybe three days.
It's like, wow, okay. Spring finally got the, but [00:30:00] it's just been really heavy raining, but I just, and it gets you down when it's gray and just like, but I was looking around and I just noticing how green and everything is. Mm-Hmm, , it's so green. and beautiful. So I just stopped because I was feeling a bit and, I'm done with all this really bad weather.
And then I was like, Oh no, but you know, it's green and that's a really lovely, lovely thing. So I sort of went and took some photos, made myself go out and take some, photos of the, of the green, the greenness and just the splendor of the nature and I definitely think helps being out in nature as you notice it makes you feel that sense of awe and gratitude.
And a fellow friend, another, we're all good life good life project people. Karen Ward did a thing called, it was called a project called [00:31:00] My Curious Eyes.
Mel: I don't
Cheryl: know if you were, I don't know if you were a part of that, but she yeah, what, what that was was just, she would set prompts, and it could be, texture or colour or whatever it was, and you just, it gave you permission to just go out in the world, take some photographs on your phone of whatever prompt was.
And then you come back and you share one and you just put, post it on this group and say a few words about it. But that made you notice things that you just wouldn't have noticed hearing about your day to day life and it felt really good. So I think when, often as mums you're busy juggling 107 things and, so you might not notice some of these things.
So I think it
Mel: has to
Cheryl: be intentional.
Mel: Yeah,
Cheryl: go right. I'm going to go out on this walk and then you start looking [00:32:00] around and you do notice things. And tuning into your senses, having that, what can I hear? What can I see? What do I smell and taste? Just to bring yourself to around yourself in the moment.
That's really important. And the good thing is that doesn't take any time. And I've just remembered a tennis frame again. One of her things. It was step, stop, look up, and breathe, which literally takes a few seconds to do wherever you are. You don't have to be outside. And just stopping, looking up, and taking that, and breathing sometimes, especially if you've got multiple children running around demanding your attention, if you, even if you just have to run into the toilet and lock the door and look up and breathe.
Yeah, that's so good. We could. And then I think I. I helped, and the reason why I mention it as well is because I I called it slub because it was got to look up, breathe, and that [00:33:00] helped me remember. Doing some slobbing is very important.
Mel: Brilliant. I love that.
The Risk of Striving for Big Dreams
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Mel: And I think you tap onto something there that is really important for the type of people that likely listen to this podcast, which is, we're talking about big audacious dreams.
So we're tend to be quite ambitious. people, right? And the risk of that, for myself, I'll just speak about myself here, the risk of that as the big dreamer, the futuristic, the that's how I, that's how my brain lives and thrives in that. It's, it's also very possible if I'm not careful to get into strive.
Mode with that, right? So let's just use the simplest example. I'm always looking at properties. I love looking at real estate, right? And I'm like, I love where I live. It is a beautiful house. There's all these amazing things about it. And I would, there's like, I want to live next to the [00:34:00] ocean. Basically. So I'm always looking for like the dream property, right?
And the risk of that, if that's the big dream, is that I'm striving for that. I'm not noticing the amazing thing that's right outside my door. Okay. Right? I was speaking to a friend the other day, she's like, yeah, but Mel, your house is my dream house. I'm like, yeah, I get that, right? And I have to step back and be like, yes, go dream.
Do all that. Please do. Like, it makes me feel really good.
Finding Gratitude in the Present
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Mel: I get a lot of energy from dreaming about that space and intentionally take the time to dream about the space I'm in and notice, you The trees or the the amount of space I have or be really grateful for the deck that's right beside me that I can step out and look at the hill over there and just little things like that.
And just while it's on my mind, what's coming up. So I've always struggled with the, like the concept of gratitude, mostly because what comes into my mind is you should be grateful. Right. And that's been [00:35:00] told to us so many times. It's over life, right? And it's not particularly helpful because it's a, it's a shame driven thing, right?
Yes.
Cheryl: That's not
Mel: it. Right. That's not it at all. So what's kind of helping me get out of that because I still want to have practices of gratitude. is one of my character strengths, which you mentioned the word is that that space of awe. So that's where it's, it's actually called something different, something about noticing beauty, but it's all essentially right.
And that gets you in a place of gratitude. So if you're struggling to be like, I'm really grateful for these three things today, it might be like, I noticed these three things today. Right? Yeah. And that's kind of the same thing in my mind anyways, or at least, yeah, so definitely a step towards. So that's just coming to my mind.
So, yeah. So the questions that I have about a million questions that we won't get to in this, this interview.
The Journey to Becoming an Author
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Mel: [00:36:00] But one of the main ones that was coming to my mind is around this concept of being an author. And these are totally like selfish questions because I look at some of the stuff that you have done and I'm like, Oh, that's like, I want to run a retreat retreat.
I'm going to write a book one day. Not I want to, I'm going to write a book one day. I just don't know what it's going to be about yet. Right. So I'm really curious, like, With the author thing and knowing that that's what you wanted to do, like, what is it about writing that draws you in?
Cheryl: Yeah, I think, I think it's because I'm a reader.
So, and to be honest, when my daughter was younger, I didn't have time to read, but I'm just getting back into reading. But I think I'm just fascinated with words and their power and whether it's story or guidance. Yeah, just [00:37:00] how, how strong and, sometimes people, I have to say, I used to have this thing where I didn't say I was an author or goes, if someone said, what do you do for a living?
I just, I would say, I'm a writer because it felt, I feel like author felt kind of, Oh, I'm an author. It felt a bit show offy. So I didn't say I'm an author. And then some, a couple of people said, dude, you're an author, you like, you've written so many books. You're an author. Just say it. It's fine. It's fine.
He didn't. Sorry, I do now. But, yeah, I just think it's, yeah, it's, it's the words. And, and also just think making, making stuff happen. I think I've learned making stuff happen is one of my superpowers, I guess.
Making Dreams Happen
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Cheryl: Like if I'm like, right, I'm going to do like the retreat thing, for example. My friend and I were just sat in the jacuzzi on a retreat, just me and her, just, we've just gone to this [00:38:00] bargain, this bargain hotel.
It was offering these vouchers and I thought, and I needed to earn a little bit of this kind of like a side hustle at the time, just a little bit of extra money, just once a year, maybe. And then it came to me, well, I could do this year, I could do a workshop as I could find get it for a decent budget price and then just add on and I'm just going to trial it and just put it together and just see.
And so I literally asked the hotel before we got home, could you do this for me? 40 people? Have you got enough therapists? And they said, yes, we could, but, and you'd have to, there were a few sort of criteria or whatever. And then I priced it up and I thought, I'm just going to do it. And then I did it and it worked and then it worked the next time.
And it's the same with writing. I think, yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, It's definitely easier [00:39:00] now than when I started out to get a book published because you don't have to go the publishing route. You can self publish. There's now Amazon, have a self publishing platform so long as you can put the words on the page, you can sort of hire a proofreader and get someone to design a cover and, you can sort of put it all together and, and, and, and literally upload a book.
You have to obviously get it typeset and not, not by, by somebody, but, yeah, you can get it and upload it and then it's available and people can sort of print on demand. But it's just having that time and, I guess, discipline and the way to write and figure out what you're going to write. And that for me, one of the most fun parts is.
having the idea, which often comes from walking and then [00:40:00] putting it together into chapters and figuring out, okay, what's that going to look like? And how's that going to flow? And, yeah, that's, that's one of my favorite bits of it. And then the writing quite hard and challenging sometimes, but, yeah, I still enjoy it.
But I have, I think I am now by realizing I'm now Thinking of maybe doing non fiction for children and either for children or for sort of more higher profile people who I think can reach more people. Because I'm, I'm okay at writing books but I'm terrible at promoting them. So I don't know how many people read, have read my own books.
Because I've just, I'll sort of do a little bit of promotion here and then I'll just, just stick to it. It doesn't interest me that much to promote it, so then I'll move on to the next one and think, oh that was a lot of work just for, people to read. But [00:41:00] no, I think some of them have done, done done well, thanks to the publishers who promoted them.
But, yeah, it's, I think with Audacious Dreams, it's having the dream and then just going out, yeah, I can do it. And I'm, I'm just, yeah. Taking those small acts of devotion each day or just doing, just doing it. And then you're suddenly like, well, I've done, I've written, I've written a synopsis or I've written this and, yeah.
That's
Mel: brilliant. And that leads perfectly to the question of what is your big audacious dream?
Cheryl: Well, yes, you talked about houses. I realize that my, in the afternoon of my life. It's funny, I've kind of done, I've achieved a lot, I've got, written lots of books and I've done, and I've managed to raise my daughter to she's 15 [00:42:00] and she's, seems fairly well balanced and she's still right.
So, I kind of like, feel like I, yep, took that. So, my big thing, I just really would like to, have my own property, get our own home again, because we, we currently renting Beautiful cottage in the countryside we did as an experiment, we were supposed to live here for a year, and there's sheep, thought you might end up hearing just sheep bleating outside, but piped up, I don't know, but there's we're surrounded by trees and sheep, it's all very lovely but we were supposed to live here for a year, and it's been five years, which is lovely.
But, just want to have my own home again, and, we've, we've, throughout my sort of, 20, but nearly 30 year relationship, I don't know, like, [00:43:00] anyway, however long, we've been together for a long time, we've rented we've bought, bought a house, then rented and funnily enough, we, we sold our house to finance our combined dream, which was, we launched a website called I like music com together.
'cause he knew that I wanted to be the, be like an editor in a music magazine was my dream at the time. I was like, I'd love to be like the editor of Smash Hits, which is a, a team, team music magazine. And if you wanted to do something, the liked. We started, I like music and ended up interviewing pop stars and stuff.
It was, it was crazy. It was just the beginning of the.com where everything was going there to put and not working out, and we didn't earn hardly any money. And we still had to do other side hustles, but then ended up building it up and [00:44:00] worked out really good. And we gotta do that for, for a living for a bit.
But yeah, for, to do that we rented and then we, rented. buy our own property a little bungalow, lived there for sort of four years, and then we kind of thought, ooh, let's try the countryside that we've been renting, and it's lovely, and I'm glad, and we timed it really well because it was before that we moved here in January 2019, and then obviously COVID was 2020, so, in terms of spacing not feeling too hemmed in, it works.
Well, for that. But yeah, I've always worked from home for as long as I can remember. So, yeah, I just want to be a bit more of a homemaker and sort of do, do that. And children's books. One day, [00:45:00] I will write, would like to write fiction. But I feel writing a novel, like a proper grown up novel. I just think, I'm just in awe of the novels I read, like the historic fiction stuff, and I'm kind of like, No, that feels too, like, I'm good at doing, like, I'm happy with doing things that are big, and striving for big things, but yeah, it feels too, too big.
So I think, I think I could do an adventure book, or I could do a book, or a non fiction book, or picture books for, for children. I want to start with non fiction. I've written one, I've written a non fiction book for three lionesses some English footballers, which, which worked well so I want to do a bit more non fiction, but yeah.
So big dream is write some, become a children's author, really, and, yeah, buy our own home again. [00:46:00]
Mel: Yeah. Beautiful. I love that. And the journey to get there. And that's the big dream and I'm going to argue and pull out that little fact that the big audacious dream is actually adult fiction.
It's just you think it's kind of like still plain allowing your mind to, to, I'm just going to put that over here for a second because it's a little too big.
Cheryl: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. But I'd love to. I'd love to do that. And in fact, it was my daughter. I do think we're just wondering to touch on to do with dreams.
Sometimes I think our children can inspire our dreams, or our projects. And so I wouldn't have written that book called three lionesses, which is about how to build self belief and find your team and embrace your lioness. And I wouldn't sort of a wellness book for children. [00:47:00] I probably wouldn't have necessarily come up with that idea and stuff, but my, but my daughter is so into football or soccer, and for American audiences, yeah, from the age of three, that I then got started.
I used to follow football but I kind of had stopped following it and now I'm all consumed by it because that's all she does. But yeah, that meant I was definitely going to watch the Euros and when I saw them won that gave me the idea to write this book and that started the process of trying to find the lionesses and Reach out to agents and put the book together and, and make it happen.
And the same as when I, together, me and her did a little website, which was just a project we ran, I ran for a little while, but it was with her influence, and it was called Climbing Trees Kids. And it was because she was [00:48:00] always, she'd go down the aisle of this, the supermarket, go down the girl's aisle, and she's not girly, she's never been very girly.
And so she would go down the boy's aisle and go, Oh, a dinosaur top, I love that. Or a car top, I love that. And why can't I wear that, and I said, well, you can wear it, you can. He said, oh, boys get all the cool stuff, I want. So I ended up, we, we created this kind of range of clothing that was sort of dinosaurs and, and stuff.
But it was kind of a bit more aimed at girls. So. Did that and wrote a book called Yes, You Can that I did a Kickstarter with to raise money about educating children about stereotypes and how you've got a big spectrum and it's all fine. Like, you could be really super girly, And into all the stereotypical girly things or not, then that's fine and [00:49:00] vice versa.
And just saying, just be yourself and be proud to be who you are. But she inspired that because she used to love Spider Man and All of that sort of thing. And then, it was as a result of that, that I did this project. So sometimes I think as mums we can get inspired, find inspiration from our, our children.
That was kind of quite a literal inspiration, but yeah, in other ways. And, and see where that takes us.
Mel: Yeah. Definitely. The inspiration comes from so many places. It might come from that walk you did. It might come from your kids. And I think what comes to my mind as you're speaking through that is that we have these different seasons in our life too that will inspire different things.
Right. And when I'm challenging you to say that maybe the big audacious dream is the, is the fict adult fiction book, it might be that that's like the late afternoon. Dream, right? Yeah. You're like, no, what I'm drawn to right now is [00:50:00] this, right? And that's okay, because that's the season in your life that you are.
And it also sounds like an amazingly big audacious dream to be honest. And we have these different seasons, and like you say, you love reading, but in the first few years, that's very difficult to do as a mother, to find the space and time and just like mental capacity to, to, to do that. So yeah, seasons is coming to mind.
Wrapping Up and Final Thoughts
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Mel: Okay, we have to start wrapping up. So yes, I always finish, I always finish with a couple of questions. One is for our listeners today who are mothers with. Big audacious dreams or ones who want to have them are kind of leaning into hoping they'll get one. What would you say to them? What's your, your top tip?
Cheryl: Well, apart from the things I touched on, which is just, it is just do it, just do, just take action.
Balancing Growth and Gratitude
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Cheryl: Aside from that, I think we touched on [00:51:00] it earlier, but it's an important part of it is to try and find this balance between growth and gratitude. Hmm.
Mel: The
Cheryl: you said. Now, your house is actually a dream house for someone else and, so I think it's really important while we're trying to pursue these big audacious dreams with the growth, focus on the big goal what you need to do believe in yourself, come up with a plan what you need to do to grow, plan, strive, and on the side of that what, what are you grateful for now and never lose sight Of what you've already got, in the present moment, but I think just sort of paying attention to how you can balance the two, the growth and the gratitude and I think I, I do touch on that in, you can flourish about [00:52:00] expectations and, and gratitude and also growth, and trying to find that balance.
Yeah. I think a lot of things come down to balance, so, especially when you're you're Going after the big dreams and being a mum. Yeah. You need some balance, a little balance or two. But it's 100 percent possible. And yeah.
Inspiration from Children
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Cheryl: And you can, and in doing so you do inspire, I think you inspire your children.
So, yeah, which is great.
Mel: Brilliant. Thank you so much for joining us. If people are intrigued by you, your story, your books, just anything about you and want to research some more or get in touch, where would they go?
Cheryl: Well, my main website is really just my name. So it's, Cheryl Rickman. So it's www.
cherylrickman. com. [00:53:00] I'm on Instagram, I am a well being author, and then of course I've also got Tweedly on Instagram, and there's a Tweedly. co. uk website as well so and also if you type my name into Amazon, there's, you'll see all the bunch of books, not the ghost written ones, the ones that I've written with my own name, so yeah.
It's been, it's been a real pleasure speaking to Mal and reconnecting and talking about these interesting, indulging, I've been talking about myself, which feels funny, but yeah.
Mel: It is an interesting one to talk about yourself and I appreciate you coming on and giving that a go. Using, using the, the spoken word about yourself instead of the written today. And, [00:54:00] having done It will have been released just shortly before yours is, but someone interviewed me for, for the one year anniversary.
And it's very strange talking about yourself. So I really I have a lot of gratitude towards every person that I invite on and, and says, yes. So do thank you for, for showing up and indulging me in that and really sharing your story with the listeners, because I think what you're doing is you know, it could be that there's a listener out there also saying, Oh, I wish I could be an author or I, I didn't even know a ghostwriter was a thing.
Like, is that a real thing? I thought it was just in movies, right? Like you're giving them that little glimpse of a, of a possibility there and, and that's what it's all about. So thank you. Yes.
Cheryl: Embrace the
Mel: Yeah. Excellent. Thank you.
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Sharing Your Dreams
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Mel: You know when you have that dream or that idea and you hold it really tight [00:55:00] and you don't really want to share it with anyone until you have it just right until you are absolutely assured that it is exactly what you want it to be but you also know deep down inside that it is unlikely to get perfect it is unlikely to get to exactly where you want it to be unless you share it with others.
It's when we share it with other people that we get the energy and the momentum. It is when we get feedback. It is when we start to iterate inside of our own minds. We need to get it out of our bodies and into the world in some sort of way. And talking to someone who will cheer you on is exactly The first step.
Now, if you can't think of anybody in your life that you would love to share your dream with in this raw stage where you're not gonna get the words right and you're worried that they're gonna come back to you and be, [00:56:00] yeah, but, or ooh, what if? Don't share with those people. If you can't think of who to share it with, then I want to be that person for you.
Totally complimentary, I am launching the Dream Haven and it is a simple message back and forth concept where you tell me your dream and I cheer you on and tell you exactly how amazing I think it is. I can be that safe space for you and your dreams to grow into whatever they're going to grow. It's going to grow.
totally complimentary. It remains your dream, not mine. And I would absolutely love and be honored by being that person who gets to hear it first. So head on over to permissiontobehuman. ca slash the dash dream dash haven. And let's get this going. Because your dream deserves to be out there in the world.
It could be a project. It could be a business. It could be [00:57:00] the change that you really want to see in the world. It could be an adventure that you really want to go on. You got this. Let's hear about it. Again, all you have to do is head on over to permissiontobehuman. ca slash the dash dream dash haven and put your details in and you'll get a video personalized back from me inviting you to take our next step.
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Conclusion and Call to Action
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Mel: That is it, folks. This has been Mel Findlater on Permission to Be Human, the podcast, and I am so glad that you have joined us here today and hope that you have taken away some tidbits that will help you go away, connect with your big audacious dream, and make that massive impact in the world that you are dying to make.
If you liked today's episode, please, please, please Like it, share it. Think of one person. Think of one person that you think would also like it and send it on [00:58:00] over to them. Let's get this out there and more moms feeling like themselves. Inspired, Dreaming big and out there. Please do head on over to find me on Facebook with permission to be human or Instagram or you can even Off me an email and say hello.
Have permission to be human always at gmail. com say hello and let me know that you listened. What did you like about it? I would love to hear if you didn't like it. I don't really want to know. Just kidding. You can share that if you want. I would love to know, however, who you are. Let's connect. Let's find out what you want more of.
I want to hear from you and I want to make it what would be useful to you. As always, remember that you have permission to dream big, permission to feel big, and [00:59:00] permission to be you. You have complete and full permission to be human. For real, you do.
