Episode 30 - Kiyasha
===
[00:00:00] Welcome to Permission to be Human, the podcast. I'm your host, Mel Findlater mother, coach, and curator of Permission to be Human, the company and community. If you're a mom, know a mom, or want to be a mom, and you crave getting out in the world to make a difference, then you're in the right place. This is a space for moms like you to connect with yourself, your purpose, and your big, audacious dreams.
Because when you feel your best, you can better you, your family, and the wider world. Let's do this.
/
I'm so excited to share this interview with you today. We are chatting to key Ash and I do. And she is not only a friend of mine who I met on my courses a few years ago, but someone who I just think is so down to earth and real about [00:01:00] everything she talks about. And in our chat today. You will hear her talk about what it's like to immigrate from another country and completely uproot herself. From one life to another to shift, not only where she lives, but to get married and to have kids.
And. Be in a completely different culture. And what that was really like for her.
And not only do we get to hear Kiyasha's story. As a mother and a professional and someone with big audacious dreams. But she's also shares with us. Some really. Powerful expertise about growth mindset. And how she's used it and how we could use it. And it's such an important topic. That.
I know in just editing this. Episode that it will. [00:02:00] Impact you in a positive way. Kiyasha is so, so experienced in so many realms, having gone from the corporate career to now working with businesses,
but in her own coaching way and within her amazing company. Called Ikigai. Do check her out, check the notes for everything that you can. Go and do with her. But Kiyasha is amazing. So stick around and hear what she has to say.
Mel: / Okay, we have Kiyasha Naidu with us today. I'm so excited to share Kiyasha with the world because we have known each other for, I don't know, maybe three years or so now, a little
Kiyasha: less.
Mel: So Kiyasha was in my Certificate of Applied Positive Psychology course with me, and we connected right away on so many different levels, and I'm so excited about everything that you have done and will do, so
Kiyasha: welcome.
Thank you. Thank you, Mel. It's it's so wonderful to [00:03:00] be here. I know we've had plenty of conversations over the last three years on so many topics. So today feels but intimidating because I'm not sure what to focus on. We've spoken about so much, but I guess, like you said, let's just open up the conversation and see where
Mel: it goes.
Exactly. And there's so many different pathways we can go down that I highly doubt this is the first and only time that we will speak. So we can just let it go where it goes and. So let's just start with, just tell us a little bit about, about you right now, or
Kiyasha: just who's Kiyasha? Who's Kiyasha? That's such a big question, and ever evolving.
But I immigrated to Canada about 10 years ago, and I'll start off there, because when we talk about
I think that was kind of the turning point that brought [00:04:00] about redefinition for me. You know, when you, when you come to a new country, I'm from South Africa originally, I absolutely love South Africa. The circumstances of leaving South Africa were not dire or, you know, I didn't have to leave. I met someone, we fell in love.
We mutually. Decided where we would start a life together and he'd been in Canada for about 20 years at that point in time. Very well established and it made sense. It made sense. I was established in South Africa, loved it, had a career of my own, defined myself very much by my career. Being single you know being independent, that was very important to me.
And I guess all the transitions kind of collided at the same time in my life. Like when we talk about transitioning I changed so many [00:05:00] roles and titles at the same time that I think that was a massive crossroads in my life. So 10 years ago, when I decided to immigrate, Not only did I change my nationality, I changed my role as going from this free spirited, independent woman who was professional and, you know, flying everywhere, doing amazing projects and campaigns in corporate environments.
To, okay, I'm new to a country, I have to start from scratch nobody knows me, I have zero social capital my credentials are not necessarily recognized, my work experience is not recognized. I am wife now.. So I'm navigating that relationship. I am a daughter in law because family dynamics culturally for me, are very important.
So it's not, Oh, you're [00:06:00] marrying someone and that's it. You are marrying into the family. So there's a lot of transition that comes with that as well. And a lot of navigating that comes with that. So again, main point here is Like a myriad of transitions all at the same time. Me having to redefine myself and starting from scratch I think can be overrated sometimes.
I think you don't understand the challenges that come with it. And you are so vulnerable in so many ways. Because for me I don't think I've ever felt that vulnerable in life. And when you're vulnerable, you tend to go into the protective mode of not how can I make this, you know, the best thing.
There's always a honeymoon period. There's always a novelty period. It's fantastic. But, uh, it's soon. You know, the reality of the situation sets [00:07:00] in and what you have to deal with, uh, at that point in time sets in. So, it was an experience. Immigration is not a joke. Transition is not a joke. I know that on this particular podcast, we're talking to a lot of moms.
Moms who, who wanna you know, change those, those labels that we place ourselves, on ourselves in life. The measurements. And the way we kind of define our worth, because I think with those labels, there's a lot of definition and measurement of worth that go along with it. And when you become a mom and all of a sudden your whole world is changed, , you have to step back and redefine what success, what self worth.
what priorities and success actually mean to you. So, who is Kiyasha?? [00:08:00] Kiyasha is somebody who's been through and continues on a journey of, navigating and defining and leveraging self worth, success, and just what life and purpose mean. That's an amazing
Mel: answer to that very broad question. And what I, what I, what I love about you, Kiyasha, is that you, your answers are always like, they're never surface level.
They're like, we're going to the goods here, right? You know, you've, you've had so many transitions, big transitions that you're describing there, you know, moving from South Africa and I don't, am I, am I right in thinking you weren't born in South Africa as well? So there was a move earlier in life as well?
Am I right? No.
Kiyasha: So very interesting. Like, I mean, just this year, I've decided to explore my cultural heritage. So I'm kind of first generation South African, but [00:09:00] of Indian descent. So worth indentured labor. There was an indentured labor system imposed by the British on India and five generations before me.
Basically, my ancestors were brought to South Africa as laborers working in sugarcane fields or different roles. Like I, I know my grand told me that her dad was like a chef for the British. Her mom was amazing in waiting. Well, her great grand, like, you know, five generations. So two generations before her.
So my ancestors came to South Africa. As laborers and built themselves up to a certain point and then yeah, I am immigrating once more, making that migration, but trying to again, hold on to those cultural roots, identity[00:10:00] all of that, I think gives you roots in a sense, uh, I'm, I'm South African, but even in Africa, I was recognized as Indian.
Yet I was born in South Africa, and now I come to Canada, and even though I'm a naturalized Canadian, uh, because of my accent, because of my look, I'm either labeled Indian, or as soon as people hear I'm from Africa, you know, my accent, it's like, okay, so she's... She's not Canadian. So again, you know, trying to trace roots, trying to trace journeys, trying to trace heritage and culture and To your question, Mel.
Not born in not born anywhere else but South Africa. Spent 30 years of my life there and then immigrated to Canada. Yeah, yeah.
Mel: And with all the other cultural things, like it's this real mismatch, or mismash, I should say, of [00:11:00] this, like, it makes me think, this question of like, who am I, in all of those transitions you just described, in all of those different components, that.
is a real central question. And I think one that we all ask, and like you said, in motherhood, we really start to ask it again. Yes. And then we put in like the culture and the, the immigration and you know, so many other things that who am I is like, it's a really big question. And one that's really hard. to answer.
Kiyasha: Absolutely. Who am I? What is important to me? Why is it important to me? What am I doing here? Like, I mean, that those were big questions that came up for me. You know, in this kind of new phase of life as a mom, because it's not just about me now, right? I'm not just like going through life on my own. I'm everything that I do is being watched and modeled and [00:12:00] replicated in a because it's not what I say.
It's what I do that's really going to impact my kids. So what am I doing with my life? How am I defining it? How am I setting the example? Not just in what I say, but in what
Mel: I do. And that's so, so true. And one of the things that always appeals in our conversations to me about you is that you really think that through a lot and, and what you do and the effects on others.
And that you're always wanting, you seem to always want to do some sort of good. for your family, but also in the wider world. And I know we've had a lot of conversations and things have taken different paths along the way, as they all do, as we adapt and, and, and shift to our ideas. But I've really loved that you're, you're always very keen to make that difference in the
Kiyasha: world.
Oh, I think when I started questioning [00:13:00] purpose, impact was one of the big things that sort of came to the surface. Like, you can do a lot of things in life, but number one, who are you impacting? And number two, how are you impacting them? Is it good? Is it bad? Is it making a difference in their life? Is it, is it intentional?
Because again, I can't control how people receive what I do, but what is my intention? That's where, what's within my control and what's not. Within my control. I think, you know, that's a big thing to, , get clarity on as you move forward on any journey, as you move forward, clarity is essential. And I think understanding what's within your control and what's important to you, that's within your control.
How it aligns with your values, your beliefs, your paradigm of life. What's the biases? [00:14:00] That you've, you've had along the way that you've picked up along the way that you may not, you know, be open to your blind spots. There's so much growth in learning that comes with redefining yourself. And I'm kind of seeing a trend here as we talk because it really is going back to that redefinition.
You know you've kind of classified yourself a certain way for so long. And then as you become a mom, there's a, there's a point where you have to redefine yourself and question, what is it that you really want? In life and that purpose side that you talked about that purpose and impact. Right? So what do you want in life?
Mel: And if you know that it's purpose and impact, once you get to that point, it's like, okay, well, what does that mean? What is my purpose? And what is the impact that I want to make? And and it's a, it's a really tricky 1 and 1 that we touch on in here is actually my favorite place to play and, like, help people with this, like, purpose and impact [00:15:00] and And trying to, like, redefine or define at all who, who we are within that.
Kiyasha: Yeah. And what matters, right? Like, though, I started off with, as soon as I came to Canada, I got back into that corporate. That corporate life because that's how I defined success is I need to get back into corporate. I need to work my way up the ladder. I'm trying to balance out having this family, but between travel, between, uh, progress, like your priorities are different.
I cannot do what a 21 year old is doing because my priorities are different. So the progress, the contribution, the focus is different within a corporate. And when you are an immigrant, you're kind of starting on the back foot. So if I had worked my way up to a certain point, you know, I'd be on a level where maybe it's more strategic [00:16:00] and I don't necessarily need to put in hours the same way.
I'd have more flexibility, have more trust within the company, um, have more of a reputation. Again, it goes back to that social capital. Like, as an immigrant, you don't have the social capital. Nobody knows you. You don't have the professional capital. Nobody knows you. So I think that was difficult. And as soon as COVID hit, and I mean, the world literally stood still, it was a matter of, well, if I had a choice with this life, what would I do with it?
And it went back to the social impact. And I got involved with social entrepreneurship. And just. Looking at how do you build an enterprise that still has an impact like there's so many connotations to the nonprofit world in terms of sustainability in terms of, you know, is it. [00:17:00] Is it sort of trade and empowerment, or is it aid and disempowerment?
There was so much around that that I wasn't comfortable with. Even though I see its value, I wanted more of the, how do we help build communities that can sustain themselves? How do we help an immigration population in Canada which The workforce is going to be a hundred percent dependent on in a few times.
How do we help them sustain themselves in this country? And the social enterprise kind of led me to how do we help people thrive, which is positive psych, and that's when our paths crossed well. And you know, that was really eye opening to say. How do we shift from that whole survival kind of mindset, which I think, irrespective of how successful you've been as an immigrant elsewhere in the world, when you come to a new country, you move from the thriving, [00:18:00] growing, developed individual into, this is completely new territory.
I need to navigate. I need to adapt in certain ways to survive. And the older you are when you immigrate, the more difficult it is because you're so comfortable with who you are in a certain sense. So this throws you out of that comfort zone and forces you to grow in ways that you may not have had to or would never have to if you hadn't immigrated.
So, you know, I think that was a, a big shift to say. This change in this adaptation is, is necessary and I need to learn. I need to grow. So, yes, I have no idea where my thought was and what I started with on that point, but it kind of took me down a,
Mel: I think, I think where you're going there is that, you know, so it sounds like if I was to kind of.[00:19:00]
Shifted to your, your story and your journey that you were talking about, you know, you immigrated, you had all the challenges that came with that in the work world, the family life, the the just cultural shift, and then had, you know, started working your way up in the corporate world, had all the challenges that come with that.
And then I had some kids and it's like, how does this work? So I started to explore, you know, and then COVID, boom, lands on us all. And that really helped you shift your priorities and, and slow down and really think through what you are wanting to do in this world. And that's what's led down this route through social enterprise and through positive psychology too.
To flourishing, essentially. So how do we all flourish in this world that has all of these things that we just mentioned and so many more? How do we struggle well, which is what you and I were talking about right before we pressed record here. [00:20:00] You know, resilience is defined as struggling well by, I think it's
Kiyasha: Chris Peterson, I want to say?
Yeah.
Mel: And... And growth, as you finished off saying there like how do we create this mindset of growth. And one of the things that you mentioned you'd love to talk to us about today is this concept of growth mindset, and everywhere that that leads.
So I wonder if you'd like to talk to us a little bit about that and where you think that people can use it in their everyday life and
Kiyasha: beyond. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know, we studied a lot of applications in terms of positive psych and I think that is the big thing. You know, as a, as an academic, you're always learning sort of theory and you're looking at how is it [00:21:00] applied?
What are the case studies that appear sort of applied to theories. But what I loved about our course in positive psychology was really having the opportunity to learn specific. exercises and applications. And I mean, look at how they apply to my own life. Like, as I was navigating this, I think the biggest value in our positive psychology course was, how do I take what we are learning and apply it to my own life?
And growth mindset was an absolute game changer. And I know, you know, you, you have sort of, Kind of hot topics and trends that always are dropping, especially in the world, world of social media. And I know like growth mindset is one of those things that you hear a lot about, but I think the understanding of do I have a fixed mindset that [00:22:00] is comparing me to, you know, people around me.
And that's how I define myself. Do I have a fixed mindset that kind of boxes my definition of success that boxes the challenges I face and what they should look like and how I should. Be handling them because there's a lot of shoulds there, right? And culturally, I think we are conditioned that way as, as a society, there are shoulds in order to succeed.
I should be doing this. This is the path to take in order to be successful. And there's so many gaps in terms of the realities we face, especially as women, especially as mothers, especially as mothers who have that. need to succeed. And the need is what we put on ourselves. It's that internal narrative that we have that says, Hey, [00:23:00] you need to be successful.
Outside of being a mom, you need to have a career. You need to have things of your own. Because we are getting so many messages from the outside. That we don't have time to look at inside, intrinsically. How do I define my success, my worth, my value? So I think, you know, understanding the extrinsic, the intrinsic, the fixed shoulds, and then the learner who's not judging.
Because I'm my biggest judge, I will tell you that. There is nobody that is harsher than me, and I've learned this through doing positive intelligence, which is a phenomenal course in terms of bringing growth and fixed mindset into play and application of positive intelligence by Shiraz Arshameenis.
It's a really, really amazing program that [00:24:00] I haven't only done myself and encouraged my closest, nearest and dearest to do, but it's something that I've implemented professionally as well.
Knowing how you talk to yourself, what you expect yourself, but from yourself, what you put on yourself, I think is a big, big part of any stress, anxiety, pressure. You feel, um,
Mel: yeah, so you've got your kind of growth mindset and your fixed mindset and are we born with these things? Like if I, if I'm, if I'm sitting there going, Oh shoot, like I do have that fixed mindset.
Is that just like, am I screwed?
Kiyasha: I think again, see, so this is, that's such an interesting question because in your fixed mindset. You are saying this is it. This is it. Like I don't have any [00:25:00] other choice because this is the way things are so finding the shift to the growth mindset is half the battle. In fact, it's majority of the battle is being able to see beyond the choices that are just in front of you or what you perceive to be, um, because it really is about.
the learning. It's about how am I growing from this? It may not necessarily be what I want, but how am I growing from it? How am I leveraging the, the challenges, the obstacles that I'm facing and how is it growing me as an individual? So I think it's, it's, it's the awareness around the mindset that you have.
And you know, like in coaching, we always ask, what is the cost? What is the cost of you not [00:26:00] making that shift? What does that mean for your life? Because some people are absolutely fine. I'm comfortable. This is what I know. Don't make me change it. I work really well within my box. I don't want to change.
That's fine. And that works, right? Like if it works for you, it works for you. But I think when your world is rocked and your box is rocked, like you have no boundaries around you because You have to redefine everything. It's a great opportunity for you to say, What is it that I really want? How do I want to look at life?
How do I want to approach life? And I
Mel: think like, we lean one way or the other, but we're both like, I definitely have fixed mindset about some things and growth about many others. Right? And I look at like, if anybody's trying to think, well, which one do I tend to lean towards? A really good example, I think, is when like, look at your kids and have a think about whether you think they're leaning one way or the other.
Because I, Okay. [00:27:00] Sometimes watching others is just easier than looking at yourself right away, just to start to understand the theory behind it. And I can look at my son, five years old, and he says, I can't. I can't do it. I can't do that. And he will get quite like extreme about catastrophizing the fact that he can't do it, whatever it is.
It could be a tiny little thing. And that would be a fixed mindset. He's like, I can't, and I never will be ever able to do this. It's just a fact, right? And I sit there and it really annoys him, by the way, but it's the best way to shift towards a growth mindset with yourself as well is just that word yet.
That's my favorite word in all. Okay. It's like, he's like, I can't, I can't pick this up or I can't do that. I was like, yet. He's like, stop saying that. But it's true because you can't do it yet, which implies you will be able to do it at some point in time. Right?
Kiyasha: Yes. There's learning and growth that is possible, that is available.
Like we have access to so much[00:28:00] information that years ago people didn't have access to. So, you know, when you, you, that definitely like the yet thing I think is so powerful, but I think it also. shines a light on this sort of misconception on positive psychology that I feel like is very important to highlight.
I don't think positive psychology is everything is fantastic, rah, rah, rah. Your life is beautiful. Nothing is wrong ever. I can do everything. It is really saying, you know, these are the cards that have been dealt. This is how I feel about it. Honestly and truly, this is how I feel about it. Without any...
I shouldn't be feeling this way. I shouldn't be feeling this way. But, how else can I look at it? I think our world is comprised of the things we believe, the things [00:29:00] we say to ourselves. And when you stop and say, Hey, these are the cards that have been dealt. I really don't feel great about it at all, but how do I want to look at it?
How do I give myself choice? In the situation, even if it's choice of perspective and it doesn't need to be great, it can be the yet I don't like it right now. I don't like it yet. I can't do it yet. But the intention is to move forward. The intention is to grow. The intention is to develop and lessons learned in any form is a is is a growth is a movement forward.
So there is massive power in yet.
Mel: Agreed agreed and I feel like we've just opened up like that was an invitation for me to do about 6 other episodes on this topic because there's so much to it. Right? Some examples we could get. There's so much we can do. But I, I am aware of your time [00:30:00] now and. So, wanna lead us on, firstly, that was great, growth mindset, like, if people are, that's like a flavour of it, right, the overall picture of this, and it's so important, I think especially as mums who wanna go out and make this impact in the world, we wanna make a business or a project or do something, as well as be this amazing mother figure that, and it's easy to start to go down that route of like, you know, It's impossible to do all these things, which frankly it is by herself.
That's a whole nother story. Impossible to do all those things, we need the village. But it's easy to go down that fixed mindset path when we're trying to build these things. Like, I can't do this. I don't know. I don't know anything about business. Right? And it's like, well actually, yet. Right? So, there's one little, little tidbit in there.
But as we finish off with our little chat today anyways, Kasia, I am curious. What kind of [00:31:00] tips you would give to the mums who are listening, who have these big audacious dreams, and somewhere along the way, whether that's in the beginning dreaming phase or they're in the works of it, they feel a little stuck.
What would
Kiyasha: you say to them? I would say, get back to you. You know, like in the least sort of narcissistic self. involved or self centered way, really in terms of cutting out the noise around you and the way things seem on the outside. Because I feel like we are in a world where, you know, beyond instant gratification, beyond just this noise and this influx of information and the world [00:32:00] of social media itself, you know, we are so impacted by media in different forms.
We kind of develop. definitions and narratives outside of ourselves. And for me, the biggest thing was to just quiet all the noise around me and get back to say, what does this mean for me? What do I want it? Bring that choice into play. What do I want it to be for me? When I didn't know how to start the business, when I didn't know what I wanted that business to be, when I didn't know why the why is everything?
Why do I want? a business. I want to have balance in my life. I want to be able to get on my bike with my husband on his and go and pick our kids up at 3 p. m. every day. I want to be able to do that and not be sitting in a meeting and my kids, [00:33:00] you know, having a completely different life at the ages of seven and five.
That's going to come. They're going to grow up before I know it. They're going to have lives of their own, and I'm going to be trying to hold on for dear life. I want to have choice right now to say what is important to me. Watching my little ones grow up is the most important thing. What do I need to have in place for that to happen?
How do I get there? I may not have all the answers. Yet, but slowly, the pieces, just like a jigsaw puzzle, they come into play. Just don't give up. Get clear on who you are, what you want, why. The most important thing, why you want it. And I think the how, with consistency and just keeping that motivation and momentum going, the why, the why leads to the how.
Once you know the why, I feel like the how reveals itself. [00:34:00] In time, but I think there's a sense of safety that you have to build with yourself in what you tell yourself in how you talk to yourself. That was a big thing for me removing the, you know, the critical voice in my head. In everything I did, I wasn't good enough.
I had to create a sense of psychological safety in my, in my mind, for me, with my internal narrative. So I think that's, that's what I would advise. Get in touch with you. Get clear with you. Create a sense of psychological safety with you, before anyone else with you. And I think everything else falls into place.
What time? That's beautiful.
Mel: I love that. Thank you for that. And if anybody would like to find you or Kiyasha you're an amazing coach. So like, just brag [00:35:00] about yourself right now and tell us where we can find you and what you're going to do for us. It's
Kiyasha: so crazy because I know in one of our conversations, we kind of brought up the cultural aspect of I struggle to market myself mainly because culturally it's seen as sort of this bragging statement, but I will tell you impact is still my focus.
I want to see people thrive. I want to learn about the different situations that people are facing and I chose coaching as My vehicle for delivering. Things like psychological safety, positive psychology cultural intelligence diversity, equity, inclusion. These are all things that I've studied, but coaching is really the vehicle for me because it is about empowerment.
It's not about somebody else relying on my perspectives, my ideas. It's about us creating a space in which [00:36:00] we get to exchange what people are experiencing healthy and how. To help them navigate it. Move forward, but giving them the space to empower themselves in finding those answers. So love coaching.
I love
Mel: coaching, you're a great coach. Where can we find you if we're like, I think that's what I need right now, and who are you looking for?
Kiyasha: So my company is called Ikigai Coaching and Consulting. I'm going to give you some links, I think, that would probably be best to share with you. So you can find me on LinkedIn.
You can find me on my website. I would love to connect. And just learn about what moms are facing out there. I think being a mom is one of the most rewarding and challenging and growing roles that you can have in life. And I would love to connect with moms out there who are navigating[00:37:00] changes in careers, in personal life, whatever you are dealing with, let's, let's chat
Mel: about it.
Awesome. Thank you so much for joining us today, Kiyasha /
That is it, folks. This has been Mel Findlater on Permission to Be Human, the podcast, and I am so glad that you have joined us here today and hope that you have taken away some tidbits that will help you go away, connect with your big audacious dream, and make that massive impact in the world that you are dying to make.
If you liked today's episode, please, please, please Like it, share it, think of one person, think of one person that you think would also like it and Send it on over to them. Let's get this out there and more moms feeling like themselves inspired Dreaming big and out there being them. Please do head on [00:38:00] over to find me on Facebook with permission to be human or Instagram or you can even pop me an email and say hello.
Have permission to be human, always, at gmail. com. Say hello and let me know that you listened. What did you like about it? I would love to hear. If you didn't like it, I don't really want to know. Just kidding, you can share that if you want. I would love to know, however. who you are. Let's connect. Let's find out what you want more of.
Yes, this is a newer podcast, so I want to hear from you and I want to make it what would be useful to you. As always, remember that you have permission to dream big, permission to feel big, and permission to be you. You have complete and full permission to be human. For real. You do.[00:39:00]
