Episode 15 - Michelle Dekeyser
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/[00:00:00] I am so excited to introduce you to Michelle DeKeyser today. Our conversation goes in so many directions, but Michelle's story of motherhood alongside. Her big audacious dream of connecting mums together as she sees that importance of community. We talk anything from identity as a mom and [00:01:00] how that shifts throughout time should S and how to shift those as well as of course community so stick around
Michelle: I'm so excited to be here. I'm glad you asked me, Mo. I love working with you. Talking with you. Anything.
Mel: Well, it goes right back at you, that one. So I'm excited to have you here and share all about your story and your big audacious dream.
Your vision of how you want the world to be is really admirable, and I think the world should hear it. So I'm excited that you're here. So tell us a little bit about you. Who's,
Michelle: who's Michelle? Michelle? That question always comes off as like, who are you? And like, I know a lot of you out there like. Have you ever been on the spot where someone asks you who you are, like, what, what happens?
That reaction, like I kinda did as a joke, right? For, she's like, I'm gonna get this squash out there. So you can get those response out there. But it really does induce that response in us. And the reason being is because for so long we're not even sure who we [00:02:00] are. We've what, what society, what we thought we should be and all that.
So I feel like when you ask that question, I'm on the discovery to that. But for me right now, in this moment of who I am, I'm really looking as to be someone who just is out there to connect and to actually be there to experience life without feeling that I have to do certain things. And I think that as moms, we have all those have to lists on there.
And so I know Mel does a great job with like the shouldings getting rid of the shoulds. I think the more we can shed those and the more I'm working on trying to shed those, the more I start to see that. For instance, the other day I was like trying to bring the inner child out again and I forgot that I love floating so much.
So normally we'd take our kids to the beach and, and I just sit on the sidelines and talk to moms. Or actually I didn't have, it was just us family, so I didn't actually have other moms to talk to, but that's certainly what I would've done. Rather actually got in the water with them and and played with them, but then also just spend some time floating.
And so I think who I am is trying to [00:03:00] rediscover some of the things I used to love to do and seeing where that leads me and just being curious about what do I enjoy my day and what are the things I wanna do? And so part of that is creating, connecting mamas and really getting out there to work with moms who feel they don't know who they are.
And it's really daily just unpeeling those and going into that self-discovery. And it's not easy. And that's why I kind of wanted to bring moms to what my role I feel was I lacked that sense of belonging. And, and, and that was part of who I am. And so I'm going, what they say is, if, if it's not there, create it.
Right? So I'm out there trying to create that, that, , feeling and, and help others do that as well. So it's kinda roundabout way of where I'm at.
Mel: I love that. And, and I love that answer actually because who am I is, is actually, I intentionally ask that question in that way because it is a big question. I don't even know what my real answer is.
Sure. I can give you all the superficial stuff, which we'll get from you in a [00:04:00] second around like, you know, where do you live and like, how many kids do you have and what's life being like? But , but actually, like who am I? One of the reasons this podcast was started was because so many moms, myself included, have gone through this identity crisis a little bit, right?
And like, actually, who am I? I don't know. You know, I'm mom. Yes. And I'm daughter. And I'm sister. And I am. I'm, I'm me. And I'm not sure what that means in each individual moment. And, and we do change that every moment of every day. Right. , then again,
Michelle: I feel like those are, are more roles than even who we really are.
Yeah. And so really getting down to the essence of like, what do you as a person really enjoy doing? And what were you brought here to provide for others? And that's what we're really searching, I think, for those answers. And we're looking at who we are. 'cause when we put the roles in front of us, it almost like stops us from really asking those questions because we're like, oh, I have these [00:05:00] things to do as a mom.
I have these things. And so yes, sure we have those roles, but when we're asking those questions, let's dig a little bit deeper. And that's, I think why coaching and, and everything is so valuable because it is hard to see that for yourself. And why like, even though I am a coach, I also. Need to be coached as well because we're all in that mode of still always unpeeling that next layer till we get there and identifying things that we really can say enjoyed my day.
And I really felt like I'm making progress on my purpose and making this world a better place than I found it. I think that's truly our goal is how can we do that?
Mel: Amazing. I love everything that just came outta your mouth. , and, and, and there's that depth, right? There's that depth and that essence of who we are.
And I think that's the human question, mom, woman, man by binary like what? Whoever you are. , I think that is the ultimate human question of who am I? And it's a lifelong journey to figure that out. Yeah. So. [00:06:00]
Michelle: Of just all the things that from a kid, like all of a sudden you start being told no to things you wanted to do.
And those nos turn into who, like this new person of not who you are anymore. And so now when you come to that realization that you wanna figure this out, again, you have to undo some of that old stuff. And the same thing with motherhood is when you became a mom all of a sudden, like things you might've liked to do before, you just start saying no to, which wasn't necessarily a bad thing, it just changes who you are.
And so then you might pause now your kids are a little bit older and go, what just happened? Where am I? And how do I figure that out? And that's why I think now and I like work so well together is we're here to say, let's do it together. We don't have to sit there and say, we have to sit here and figure everything out on our own.
But like by talking, being seen by heard, heard by each other, that it helps us to get through that silent process. 'cause yes, we still do have to go inward by ourselves at times, but then we take that and share ideas with other moms out there to [00:07:00] help figure that out.
Mel: Definitely, definitely. And I am excited to, ask you all about that element of it.
And I'm gonna backtrack for a second just because you and I know each other pretty well, so we're, we're jumping deep quick, which is, is amazing actually. , but for some background, for our listeners, maybe could you tell us a little bit about what your journey has been like?
Michelle: Well, everyone has like, says like they have that defining moment, right?
And for me, it was actually during the midst of Covid. It wasn't quite the beginning, all the scared stuff, but we had some,, health issues in our family with a couple members having cancer. So we decided that we were gonna homeschool the kids for a year, which all of a sudden I got full board onto At the same time, I felt so lost and unsure of myself.
I was like, how do I keep up with these three kids at home that at the same day, so September 1st, 2020, I also started doing this, a program called the 75 Heart. Some of you may have heard of it, some of you may, but it's just one of those programs where it's basically just a checklist. So it's like 2 45 minute [00:08:00] workouts a day.
One has to be outside, drink a gallon of water, getting a diet, seeking to it, taking your picture, reading your reading. Some kinda nonfiction. But the caveat is if you don't do any one of those things for that day, you need to start back at day one. So it's really first lesson I had in being consistent and showing up for yourself.
And I think that's the hardest part is saying yes. And actually it's ironic that I'm talking today because, today I actually, I felt like was a new shift in me and when I'm trying to turn to like the hard 30 for the things I need to do for my business and, and what am I feeling not consistent about myself right now and deciding that there's two things in the morning I'm gonna do, because one thing I haven't been consistent with was movement and , really just.
Coming out and, and going on social media every day just, just to give my message. So what I did this morning is I took my 20 minute walk and then I did a two minute re or one minute reel. But those are the two things for the next three days that I wanna do. Sorry, si side note on that. But I think it is about that consistency and that's what I was [00:09:00] lacking.
I was saying yes to everyone around me, but not saying yes to myself. And I think that's where we start feeling that lost feeling where I was feeling like I didn't know what I wanted. I had trouble making decisions, I was just all over the place. And when you have that empty, like 15 minute pockets where the kids are playing by themselves, all of a sudden you're like, I was playing Candy Crush, or I was just watching tv, or I was getting a drink, or, or whatever it was that numbed me at that moment.
So I could just, you know, fill the time rather than use the time in a way that, that I felt passionate about. And that's where I was when I started this program. And he, and, and it, and in his vision, when he gives us his podcast, he's like, you don't know where this is gonna take you. And I, I mean, I had no idea.
All I knew was I need to start showing up for myself and do that. And so I did that and, and the al effect it had on my family and things, and then just giving me the clarity I need to decide that, what I wanted to do. And that was eventually creating connecting Mamas, because I went on this journey and I was like, yes, this is great.
But the [00:10:00] best times were when I had an accountability partner, I had someone to share it with and do these things and then have someone to talk about and realize I'm not in this alone. And that was always a hard part of motherhood, I thought was, I felt, even though I was doing all these play dates and, and around people, it wasn't having those deep conversations.
And it was always just like, what are the kids up to? And they're having this problem or that problem. And it wasn't like, what's your dream? Like, I like for here on this podcast, what's your big, audacious dream? Like, we didn't, you don't have those conversations. And that's what I was lacking. And the more I start to see that, the more I realize I do want more as, um, the feminine mystique points out, which was written in 1960s.
She caught it, the problem with no name, with the, the housewife. That just felt, I want more in life with that guilt. And, and I shouldn't because the femme mystique of what society puts on us, we don't deserve or shouldn't have. And yes, we've changed that since the sixties and people are in the workforce and when we do have [00:11:00] women out there, but it's still that same now.
Okay, you got the workforce and you still got the home life and do both. Good luck. Yeah. And so we need each other to talk those things out and strategize. How do we combine those two together to make a rhythm rather than, I don't even like the word balance, because when there's, you say balance, there's like a pressure on both sides.
But when you say rhythm, sometimes you're gonna spend more time in the work, sometimes you're not. And it's like up ebbs and flows rather than it has to be equal. 'cause there is no equal in here. There's just how do we flow through the day so that we get the most enjoyment out of it and, and get the most out of spending time with our kids who are gonna be out the door before we know it.
I mean, I look at my 12 year old and I'm like thinking he's six years away. He, he's already been in my house longer than when he goes to college. Like he's six years away from being in college. When you put in perspective like that, you're like, that is not that much time. At the same time, I wanna be that role model for him, that he doesn't just see some resentful person who didn't go after what they wanted.
And [00:12:00] that wanting for me was that connection and creating that for other moms, and that's kind of where connecting moms came into place and just wanted to create this space because I feel so alive when I'm working with the moms and in the groups and like, it is like a medicine for all of us just to be seen and heard and not feel judged.
I think that's the biggest thing with motherhood is that judgment and just feeling like you scroll on Facebook and you're like, oh, well I'm not doing that. Oh, I should be doing that. That's not what Mother has should be about is each of us, we're doing motherhood the best we can. And each of our kids are individuals and we're here to help each other, not criticize, not judge each other, but support each other in the decisions we're making.
And we're struggling so much with making those decisions 'cause there's so many to make. And when you don't know what you want, it's hard to make a decision 'cause you have no end goal in mind to make that decision off of. And so I love what the coaching is coming up with that end point and then figuring out how to work towards it.
But it's [00:13:00] really hard to come up with that end point when you're just in the, the muck of it all and not taking the time to think it through. And so that's, I think as moms, what we need is that space and that place to do it. Um, to really just come up with what is it that I actually want? And same question with who am I?
Is just as, as hard as what do I want? We have no problem saying what we don't want. And the more we say that, The more we're still gonna get it because whatever we focus on, we're gonna get. Yeah. There's So
Mel: I think that answered your question. Yeah, I think, I think so. It's answered it well enough. Um, because I think there's, there's, there's tons of good gems in there.
And the ones that are standing out to me is you're talking about how a, a big part of your journey was shifting from this place of where you were saying yes to everyone else, but not to yourself. And I think that's a really powerful way to put that. And [00:14:00] we do, as moms, realistically, our kids will come first most of the time.
Right. That is like, that is the way it is. Push come to shove. If they really, really need us, we're gonna, we're gonna go because we're caretakers, we're mothers. That's, that's our role and that's our, that's what I want to do. Right, right. And. What we are saying in all these conversation we've been having, uh, you and I, but also on this podcast is, is not saying don't do that.
Right. It's saying, yeah, not all do that and say yes to you too, once in a while. That means you have to say no to someone else's need that maybe isn't as high as what yours is in that moment. Right? But it means saying yes to to, to both.
Michelle: What it really means, saying no to are the things that you're using to pass time away with.
Hmm. So like if you were just feeling listless and [00:15:00] scrolling on your face, I mean, look, think about how much time you're on Facebook or think about the times that you were. Just stuck making a decision. But it, it's when you're doing the planning and you're doing these things where you're all like, well, I have this goal so I don't need to waste time.
Making those decisions are already made. And so for instance, like even a morning routine, my mother-in-law came by, was like, our house never ran that smoothly, but it was creating up a system that worked for my kids. 'cause they are not, they do not like checking stuff off. So I gave up, I tried many, many times to get them to like want a goal and check things off and it just did not work.
And I wasn't consistent. So we just made a list of questions that they had to answer and it just became such a routine that. I wasn't stress in the morning. That was my biggest thing when they ended up, actually, I mentioned the homeschooling part, but they ended up going back to school. Long story, but it was making those decisions that, how do I make this easier for the flow of the day?
And so putting those systems into place makes that run smoother, that I'm still able to get a shower in the morning while they're getting ready for school. They're making their own breakfast if they want a lunch and they don't like what's at school, they're making it [00:16:00] unless they ask for help. Like there's caveats on it and things that we can do when we, when we get the help.
And the idea is 'cause we just not seeing the possibilities of what is, yeah. We're like, this is the way it has been, this is the way it's gonna go and I'm just gonna feel this way. And it doesn't want to be that way. It's, it's looking at the possibilities and working with other moms that have come up with systems or come up with ideas of how to make it flow better.
Because again, it's not a balance, it's how do we flow through our day so that we're able to be more present, not as angry, and actually enjoy it. Yeah.
Mel: Both in with your kids and without. Right. Because I think a lot of times those little things that we're filling our time with that scrolling, that Netflix series, that whatever is 'cause we're freaking exhausted.
Right. Exactly. And our mind is saying, I wanna turn off. So I don't wanna fill those times with, uh, dreaming. Honestly, that's very rarely what I wanna fill those times with. 'cause I'm too tired. [00:17:00] Exactly. Yeah. To do that. So I need to do something that will replenish my energy, which will then let me start to dream.
Michelle: Exactly, because when we're doing those things and taking care of ourselves, then we, the energy that we would've been doing something else. And I'm not saying if you have a great Netflix show or something that you want, that you should give that up. No, but be selective and say, I'm actually looking forward to that show, and I'm not just sitting there because yeah, I have nothing else I could be doing or, or I don't have the energy for it because I wasn't working those sips.
But if you're like, I, this movie's coming out and I'm gonna go enjoy it, by all means go enjoy it. Yeah. This, when we're making those decisions, sitting there going, I'm gonna do this because I can't do anything else. And it's because we're out of energy and it's because we're not seeing the possibilities of, of other ways to do things.
And we're not saying that you're not gonna give your time to your kids or any of those things. We're looking at those pockets of time that you have and organizing them ahead of time so that you're not just sitting there going, oh, I [00:18:00] don't know to do it myself and figuring those out. But again, it's not, you can't do that until you have that dream put into place.
Yeah. And you have a why or something that you actually want. And that's the hard part. 'cause we love to use excuse. I'm so busy. I'm so busy, I don't have time for that. And that I hear is the number one excuse. It's not even necessarily the money. As much as I don't have time,
Mel: I can't do that. And I think it's not time that they're even saying though.
I think, and, and me, myself included, having said that many a times ironic use of phrase, but um, it's not mental time that I'm saying in that moment. It's a mental capacity. I don't have mental capacity because I'm doing this, this, this, this, this, this, this. I'm responsible for all of these things and they're all spinning around in my head right now.
Yes. Right. And I think the point about, you know, sitting down and filling our, our space when we're exhausted with something else, that's like actually still external stimuli. So [00:19:00] yes, it can be enjoyable to sit down and watch a show. I watch plenty of Netflix, Netflix series. Right. And, um, if that's what I'm choosing all the time, it's not going to be, it doesn't replenish my energy.
No, it doesn't. It numbs those thoughts and feelings in my brain, which sometimes is necessary, but not all the time. Oh yes. And actually, so what can we fill those spaces and that time with including the answer of nothing. Right. Like how, when was the last time just sat or laid down on the sofa and did nothing?
Michelle: Well, that's just it. 'cause we're so afraid of being bored or not having something. So think about the times when you could just sit there, no one's even around you and you're sitting on the couch, you reach for your phone or you reach for something. 'cause you're afraid to be by yourself. Yeah. And I think that's what came down to, 'cause I was so the same way and before I had kids, I can remember I was, um, [00:20:00] what they call a K teacher.
So I was kind of like a permanent sub. So I would get home from work around three 30. My though we weren't married at the time, we'd get home, he'd get home at 5 36 and during that time, I'd sit there and watch soap operas and stuff because I didn't know what to do with my time. Like I felt this listless energy.
Yeah. And I was like, I could be doing something, but I had no idea what to do with it. And I feel that's where mothers a lot of moms are at right now, who I, the, the problem that we say the problem of no na um, no name that she mentions the book, is that listless feeling that you want more, but then you're doing the dishes and all of a sudden you start crying and you don't know why and you're like, oh well it's okay.
And you just wash that right back down. Yeah. And then you do it again. You're sitting there watching TV and you're just like, I feel so listless. I feel so at ends, but you know what? I'm just gonna ignore it 'cause I got all this stuff to do. Yeah. But that's when we need to come together and say, well, what is your dream?
And you don't have to have the answer right now, but if you just start asking the questions and start bringing the curiosity to [00:21:00] what you enjoy doing, then you can start getting that answer. Slowly and, and that's the problem is it's not fast enough we're, we're in this fast paced society. It doesn't keep up.
If it's not a 15 minute, 15 second thing, then we're off to the next thing. I mean, granted, which is why the space of sitting by yourself and getting comfortable with that is so important. But it took me a long time to get there and, but I will say I do enjoy just sometimes, like I feel like I'll say like, oh, I should be listening to a podcast right now, or getting more information.
But it's like, no, I'd actually rather just do the dish in silence and just be, and not have anything else. But it's such a hard thing to get used to. The more we do that, the more we do start to listen to ourselves and be able to answer the question, who am I? Yeah. And we start taking
Mel: the layer off.
Definitely. And I think what's coming up for me there is the abilities I. To, 'cause that's, I feel like I'm just [00:22:00] shifting that as we go and I'll start to do something. So for, like, for example, I was just at a conference all weekend. I'd literally been talked at all weekend, right. Um, and my brain was full and I was, and, and my, my heart was full too.
'cause I got plenty of conversations in there as well. But my brain was full and I was very, very tired. And I had a very rare ferry ride to take by myself with no children. Just me. I can do anything I want. Right? And having had a conversation with someone else earlier, they're like, oh, you can use that time to reflect.
'cause I was talking about when I wanted to reflect on all that I just learned and kind of like, try to make sense of it a little bit. So I was like, yeah, that's a really good idea. That's exactly what I'm gonna wanna do Then. Um, and then I get on the ferry and I do it for about five minutes. And where I've managed to shift to now is I, I listen to my body better.
So I, I can't even tell you exactly why, but I can [00:23:00] notice now if I stop for a second in, in that moment, that doesn't feel good and I don't need to rationalize that. And I need to remove the should of, like, this is the only time I'm gonna get to do that, blah, blah, blah. You know, all the things spending in my head and just like take a big breath, which I literally wanted to just did right now, even remembering it and be like, okay.
And I just put it on the chair beside me and I laid my, my chair down and I didn't fall. I didn't close my eyes. I just kind of laid there and like looked around and didn't really do a lot right. But I knew what I didn't need was more information in my head. So then I'm like, okay, so then we get off the ferry and I am tired as heck.
It's like 10:00 PM and I have an hour drive home. I'm like, Hey, in order to keep myself awake, I gotta turn something on. I gotta listen to something right to turn my brain on, but my body is going, no, no, you cannot. I will not take it any. So I turned the radio on and it was [00:24:00] like some audio book that I like.
I listened to two sentences. I was like, Nope, smash it off. Okay. Right. And just keep driving. Okay, I'm gonna push play on a podcast over here, start listening to it. Usually one that I really, really enjoy. Nope. Turn it off and 'cause my, uh, because I could tell that my body was like, no way can I like it.
Just, it's overstimulating actually at that point in time. Um, And so I drove back and, well, I say in silence what I ended up having to do at points. 'cause I also needed to stay awake other than opening, et cetera. Um, in the dark was, uh, I, I just sang to myself all times. I just started singing about, okay, I gotta turn the corner.
You know, I love it just to keep myself on
Michelle: those in internal thoughts
Mel: out there ex Exactly, exactly. Take the internal, my stomach feels weird, like just start talking. But the point of the point of bringing that up, being that, [00:25:00] I think one of the things we can all do to get to the point before we get to the point where we can even start to dream about our dream, essentially start to think bigger, is to listen to our bodies.
And to slow down and to allow ourselves to sit in that discomfort. 'cause it's really uncomfortable, especially at first, but usually to be honest, yes. It's, um, you have to go through the uncomfortableness of it to get to the, the niceness of it really. Um, and to ask another question, which is, what do I need?
What do I need right now? Like, what's my brain say? But also what does my body say? And my body, and it can be different in, in any moment. My body was saying I needed to sleep and unfortunately I couldn't give it that until I got home. But, um, but you know, sitting [00:26:00] on a sofa, if I'm about to turn on a show, what do I need?
Oh, I'm just bored. I need, I need rest, I need silence. I need, whatever it might be. I need to go to bed. Even if it's seven o'clock, right? Like, who knows, depending on the day or I need to breathe or I need meditation, or I need movement, or I need, you know, all, all the different things. The question is what do I need?
And then once we start to actually give ourselves what we need, then all of a sudden when we start to like even whisper to herself, what do I want? Right? Oh, it comes out. Yes. And it starts to come. But we're so used to pushing it all down our needs down and not meeting them that we can't even think of want yet.
Right.
Michelle: Um,
Mel: exactly. Yeah. So that was my, that was me going off on my tangent on that one.
Michelle: I wanna add two things to that and , one comes from Brendan Burchard. 'cause actually I went to one of his four day conferences and I love how he [00:27:00] puts that our bodies are. Generate power. They're, they're, they're not.
We, we need to, to feel the energy. So what, which is, one of the things we did during that, , seminar was we did Ong and it's actually something I started doing with my son, , one of the programs we could do. And it's, and it's finding ways to feel that energy. And so maybe it's moving around, maybe it's dance.
What is it that feels like your body full of good energy, right? We wanna move that energy around and get somewhere to that stagnation. And so maybe that's also what your body needs when you feel like you're really tired. Maybe it's just that you're, you're just more overwhelmed and you just need to release some of that stress from you.
And so it is releasing that stress and that movement, , of how you find that is yoga, dance, aerobics, whatever it is, whatever kind of mood it is. Maybe it's just a walk getting outside and getting some fresh air. But it's, when you're in those moods, is, is removing that because then that releases the barrier.
I. No, I wasn't actually really that tired. I just, I had all this overwhelm feelings in me that I need to release and then gives you the space to have those [00:28:00] positive thoughts and keep it. The other second thing is to keep in mind that our thoughts are geared to be more negative, like our, we're hardwired until we start to make that change in us.
And so it's, it's, that's part of the stillness, which I think people struggle with the stillness is, is the thoughts come negative right away when you start the process. Yeah. And they don't see the other side like, oh well, I'm just not good at meditation. I'm not good at sitting still. And it's that you're working at, I think it's Emily Fletcher who says with meditation, you're not working at getting good at meditation, you're working at getting good at life.
So by learning to be more calm and more still, then you're able to respond later in the day instead of react to other people because you are training your brain to do that, to be in that space. Every meditation, you're not gonna, not, thoughts are not gonna stop. We're not trying to erase thoughts from our heads.
We're trying to be still more often. And so I think the more often that we do that, we're going to make space to let [00:29:00] those positive dream thoughts come in and say, this is who I am, this is what I want. Now I'm gonna go after it. And then you want your support team to go after it with, because it's easy when you're in that beginning phase, it's then asking, am I gonna re recommit to this when it does get hard?
Yeah. Because it's, it's never gonna just be, oh, well this is a piece of cake. I, I'm a superstar with whatever I want do and, and I gotta right away. Anything worthwhile is getting through the barriers that come up in you because you do have those barriers, so within you till you start to release each one of 'em as they pop up.
Yeah. And it's going through that process over and over being still figuring out the next barrier. Moving past it. Until you get to a place. But again, this is a lifelong journey where, who are we at this point? We're uncovering all of that as we are. You can know who you are at this moment in time, but it's gonna change tomorrow.
Hopefully. Change is inevitable. [00:30:00]
Mel: Definitely. And I think something really important that you pointed out there is, is what that's called is your negativity bias. And we all have it, right? So we will notice the negative in our life and no matter how much we work on it, we will always notice the negative.
That's the way our brain is wired because it protects us, right? Yes. And that's okay. And what it also means is that we have to be intentional and we have to purposely try to notice the good as well, right? Yes. It's harder, harder, more than we notice the negative, which is very difficult to do. 'cause we notice that a lot.
Michelle: Yeah. 'cause I mean, you think back to your childhood memories or something, the negative ones just kinda like pop up. But then when you start thinking about, like it's, it's like you have to work at the positive ones, but then you still start to remember them. And so it's, it's that intentional and it is effort.
And that's why we say this, this work of describing who you are is not necessarily easy. It is intentional and repetitive to keep doing that over and over and not just say, okay, well I know I'm done. Yeah.
Mel: So one really [00:31:00] good way, this seems like a good, good time to bring it up, is, there's an activity you can do, which is like research back to better in increase our wellness, is called three good things.
And every day write down three good things that have happened and how you impacted them.
Michelle: Oh, I love that. I wanna just add something to that. Well, I wanna change the word good to magic. Hmm. Because I think that when we actually look for the magic, we start to realize that like all of a sudden those coincidences, when you start meeting someone new or something, it really is your brainwave sending out new things that bring things towards you.
And it really is magic. So instead of just good, let's take a step up and say, what are three magical things that happened today? And really just put that into place and put that out there. Yeah. And start noticing it. Yeah, I
love
Mel: that. I love that word. Someone else that I, uh, was chatting to recently had they do with their kids, tell me one good thing, one challenging thing, and one thing that made you laugh.[00:32:00]
And I really love that. I think that, , that's wonderful. I like the laughter one, and it reminds me of what you just said because it's, it's that magic side of it, right? It's the things that, like, it might've been something bad that happened that you'd think is really funny if you think like Exactly. You could shift it in your brain.
Right. And I, I tried, I started trying to do that with my five-year-old, , who has a very strong negativity bias and, and. I never liked that. When you do tell me a good thing and then a challenging thing. 'cause you do wanna acknowledge permission to be human, right? That like things are hard and maybe bad things happen that, or things that you interpreted as bad happened that day.
, but then you finish on that and I'm like, oh, that doesn't feel right either. So I like this laughter one as well. Um, I love that too. I'm gonna have, you could put magic in that, but, because it makes you finish strong and it gives us an opportunity. 'cause I answer the question too. It gives us an opportunity to model that.
My, my laughable things are usually something ridiculous. So like, right now I can think of the other day I bought these new shoes to go to [00:33:00] this conference with, and they're, they're just like flats. I almost like ballet type shoes, right? But I'm used to wearing very like, uh, barefoot friendly, so very like open toe, blah, blah, blah.
Anyways, , Oh, so I was wearing these shoes and my shoes, my feet were killing me because I hadn't worn them brand, like brand new first day, right? So every session I was like taking them off and like just sitting them next to my feet on the, on the floor while I was sitting on the chair. And and my little baby toe on my right foot kept getting so sore.
And then this was like hours later, I looked down at the shoes that sitting next to my feet and I was like, those don't go on those feet. They go on the opposite feet. And I was just like, I could say that would be a really bad thing. Obviously it was my toe was killing me, but it was so funny. Right.
That's funny. So that, that's the types, it's funny, right? Because like I can laugh at myself over it because it's so ridiculous. It's such a simple thing to do. [00:34:00] Um, and they're very sim like it's hard to tell these shoes which ones, which to be fair. But my, my point in bringing that up is because that's the type of thing I could say is a funny thing to my child or to whoever.
And I'm role modeling the fact that I made a mistake and it was funny and I'm okay with it. Well
Michelle: I love that so much. 'cause that actually, like, as you were describing, that, that twinge on the perfectionist wanting to be in me, that like that helps turn that idea that, you know what, it doesn't have to go that way all the time.
And, and laughter sometimes is hard because you're like, oh, I have to be so serious. I have to do this this way. And so the more that we can just find the enjoyment and the the humorous in the day, the better. And I just love that story 'cause it's so true. It's like something that's like painful. But at the same time, well actually on that note, I'll say, um, Uh, my son and my, um, husband have a garden on the back.
Yeah. And both of them have had really bad reactions to a weeded out [00:35:00] there so bad that their faces have puffed up. And I've worked in it a couple times and, and haven't, I'm not the best gardener, but on Saturday I decided that I was going to go help weed because it was so bad and they refused to go in there.
And my arms, oh, you guys only on YouTube, you see it? My arms are like covered right now. Oh, yes. And the rash. Yeah. But, and that's why, that's why I'm wearing a long sleeve shirt in summer to keep it away. But I look at it and I was just like, Jasmine looks and goes, well, I see you're not completely immune either, but it's just looking at going, what have I learned from this?
And it's just learning that like I've still had fun doing it and it was something that I want do for them. And, and I mean, yes, it's annoying, but the, the more I laugh at it, the less it itches actually. It's because I'm not like, oh my God, this is bothering me. And I'm not focused on it. I'm just like, okay, well it happened, whatever.
Let's move on. Yeah. And I just keep putting the more, because it keeps seeing it spread a little bit. It's like keep putting more cream on it. But I think when we do that more often, then we're not focusing so much on it being what [00:36:00] we'd call bad. Yeah. And then it'll just go away. Yeah. And, and we, it wasn't such a bad thing.
And I think we focus too much on that and we do make things so negative. Yeah. And our thoughts just, I mean, I could sit there. I, I mean, back in the day I might've been like, why did I do that? Why did I do that? And then like, the next day, why did I do that? Why did I do that? I shouldn't have done that.
This is really bugging me. This is so annoying. Yeah. And it would just keep perpetuating and I'm sure it would even last longer. And then what's, I think because I'm focusing on it, I'm starting to itch a little bit more right now, which this whole entire time, I haven't even noticed it till right now.
Until I pointed it out. Yeah. Again, what we think about, we focus on.
Mel: Exactly. Exactly. And for those, I imagine some of our listeners might still be in that space where that's how they would react, right? Because like we're all just in different stages of this, of this journey of figuring that out and, and it's okay.
And I think the important part is to note that it is totally normal to have, like we all have a negativity bias. And it's important to not make it [00:37:00] personal. Like I'm like, it'd be easy to say, oh, I'm a negative person. That won't work for me. Right? No, you're not a negative person. You are just a human who notices the negative.
And it's a lot harder to no notice the positive. And we have to work so hard to start doing it. And the more we do it, the easier it becomes. But it still is intentional,
Michelle: right? And it's a learned behavior. Like everyone keeps thinking, oh, well that person's so positive, they must have just been born that way.
But they every day so consciously make choices to do that because stuff still happened to 'em. I'm sure they still get a flat tire. They, they still things like their kids spit in their face or whatever it is. I mean, like those things still happen to 'em. But again, all those things are still gonna happen.
It's do we react or do we respond to it? And the way that we get to respond more often is because we're filling our cup beforehand. Yeah. Because when we don't fill our [00:38:00] cup, then we're irritable and we're angry Yeah. Going throughout the day that when something like that happens, all of a sudden we, we flip our lid so much quicker.
Yeah. Than is if we were taking care of that stuff. For instance, the other day, um, I was so proud of my daughter. She's making wa waffles from scratch and my, the way she's learned from my husband is put it all in the blender and stuff. Right. She's like, I'm fine. 'cause she already done, she had already done it once a, uh, twice a summer already.
So I just went on to take a shower. I get out of the shower to hear her screaming up the stairs. Anytime she does a scream up the stairs, it's because she's angry at something that she did that she didn't do perfectly. Mm, yeah. It's, it's like, I know that screams. I'm like, okay, what just happened? Well, she was putting all the stuff in and um, somehow turned the blender on, so there was batter, literally everything.
Oh, no. And I was like, okay. I walked in. I could have just, you know, could have first reaction, could have beat the yell or whatever. I'm like, she's already so angry and upset. I'm like, she's already beat up [00:39:00] herself enough by herself. Like me getting angry would not have helped, but I was only able to be in that space because I had taken care of myself that morning before they got up.
And I was just like, okay, Bella, y y And she was just like, she's like, I'm gonna come help. I'm like, you're too angry to even help right now. I will just start cleaning up. You just, you go take care of you right now. Like, You don't need to clean this up right now. You, you were trying to do something. It was a mistake.
Just when you're ready, you can come help me. And then about probably 10 minutes later, I was still cleaning. She came to help. But I think it's recognizing that for them, because that's what we need sometimes is we get so angry and we do need to take that time out before we come back to the situation.
And so I'm just trying to demonstrate for her, like, you don't have to clean up right away. Like I'm, I've got you for that. You can come back when you're ready and we need to, we need to model that as mo as parents. And we do. 'cause I mean, we are still gonna react at times and we're gonna react more, but the more that we can respond, the, the, again, the flow of the day is that, okay, well the [00:40:00] pancake spilled, or waffle batter I guess.
And, but then she went because of that, she went right back into it and finished making the waffles.
Mel: It could have been so much not her. But you're also modeling that for yourself, right? Because you're, you just, you just told your brain that you can react in a way that is kind of more laughing at the situation.
There's a little more, you know, um, attentive to what it is instead of super reactive in the, on the negative sense. Um, so next time it'll be easier for 'cause you're being like Exactly. Oh yeah, that I can do that. Um, so you mentioned that, uh, in that particular scenario, you were able to manage that because you took your care of yourself in the morning.
What does taking care of yourself look like for you?
Michelle: Hmm. That's, that's actually, like I said, with the consistency is something I felt like I wasn't, um, like when I did the 75 hard, I was very consistent with the routine. I had to 'cause I that set routine and that, so that since I've stopped doing that, I've been trying to find something for myself.
And so I would still [00:41:00] like sit there and meditate and do these things, but. Um, I noticed that I wasn't showing up as well as I could be. Like, I was like, oh, well I'm gonna just put my bathrobe on. I'm just gonna go sit on the couch. And like, but I wasn't putting that effort and energy for me into that. And, and so for me it was like I wasn't showing up for myself.
I was like, oh, well I can just put the bathrobe up. That's how I'm showing up for myself. And so, ironically today, um, my husband had to get on an early flight, so I got, I usually get up at five anyways, but I got up to take him to the airport, came back, and for the first time in a long time, I just did my old, usual 20 minute walk around the neighborhood that I haven't done in forever by myself in the morning, first time, first thing, because I've been doing Chicago with Liam, or I've been walking with a neighbor doing other stuff.
And I was like, you know what? If I don't do any of that stuff during the day, that's okay. 'cause I did it in the morning first by myself and just not the time to think and have, sometimes I'll listen to podcasts or things, but a lot of times it's just quiet time just to wake up. And then, like I said, for the business, I wasn't showing up feeling like, so I went and did, um, a reel just because I, if I got those two things done in the morning, [00:42:00] first thing, because I've been struggling with those.
Then I was showing up for myself. So I feel like, and it doesn't have to be a lot, so, but if it, there's something like meditation or journaling or something that makes you feel better, picking that thing to do in the morning before your kids see you is what it's about. And again, whenever your kids wake up it, it could be a matter of making up 15 minutes before them, five minutes before them just to do it before you interact with them.
Your phone, anything is picking something that will light you up and set intention for your day. 'cause again, it really comes back to that intention that we do have to set daily 'cause we have that negative bias and so we need to set ourselves up for that day. And so for me today was like putting my, he my foot in the sand saying I'm gonna be more consistent for me.
And it wasn't for anyone else. I mean, if no one watches my reels on, on, on Instagram or whatever, that's okay. 'cause I'm not doing it for them. I'm doing it to show up for myself and say I'm consistent to you. Yeah. And that's all that matters. Yes, [00:43:00]
Mel: yes, and yes. And two things come up for me. One is for those that the morning, waking up early doesn't work, which I'm one of them.
And I don't mean early, early. I mean, my child ends up in my bed halfway through the night, so if I get up, he gets up. There's, there's no in between. There's always another place you can find it somewhere in your day. And I do try to aim in the morning, but for me it's the shower. We've had this conversation before, right?
The shower is the only place if I go to the bathroom, my kid still follows me in half the time. But if I go in the shower, he knows he is not allowed to come in my bathroom, right? And if he does, he'll just like run back out because he knows that that's my space. And um, so that's where I do, you know, a little meditation or a little, I, I actually do like a compassion thing for me.
I have compassion showers, but um, yeah, so there's always another space and each person. But I do
Michelle: actually wanna challenge you, Mel. Go on then. Even if your kid's in your bed. Before you open your eyes and you know they're, they're awake. If you take two deep breaths [00:44:00] to yourselves or give you yourself one affirmation mantra, one minute.
Yep. Your baby's crying over there. If you just sit the, at your bed, take two deep breaths before you walk over to that baby, that changes your state. So it's not that, and it's, that's why I'm saying it's, it's, it's really about the intention. So even if your kid's in your bed, your eyes are shut, you're awake, you decide if it's breath, if it's saying a poem in your head, if it's something that you can just do in your bed that you set up, that you decide ahead of time, you're gonna do that in the morning.
And again, one minute. Yeah. That's how we're talking about. And then of course, shower and playing throughout the day. No, definitely.
Mel: Yeah, I totally agree actually. And it's really easy to get into the mindset where, because I can't do the big thing like get up and do yoga that I wanna do, right? Or go sit by myself in a room and meditate for 20 minutes, like it's just not gonna happen right now.
Um, it, it's easy to say it's all or nothing when actually like a few breaths, which I do do in the morning, a few breaths right before I even get up, um, [00:45:00] is, is way more important. And, um, and getting outta the habit of picking up the phone that might be beside the bed instead, right? Yes. Um, so that's, that's a really good point and, um, I'm trying to think of what the other thing that was coming up for me while you were speaking was
it's gone, but that doesn't matter. Okay. So where I would really love to go with you, because this is a conversation and a topic that has come up multiple times, um, in our conversations together is this, this concept that we need other people. And that community matters. So tell me a little bit about, uh, your journey with that or your thoughts around that, wherever you'd like to start.
Michelle: Well, I think for the longest time I struggled with the idea of belonging. And as through therapy, I realized part of that was just things that happened in my childhood and the trauma of that, that it was hard for me to put myself out there. Like I was so busy trying to make [00:46:00] sure that I was the right person.
This group wanted, I was kind of like embarrassed of who, or not wanting to admit who I was, that I was so busy trying to be someone else. And I, I think it was Rob, do some, and I might paraphrase it wrong, but he was, he, what he said was that when we do that, it's not that we're looking for acceptance from someone else because we don't like who we are because we're not being us.
And so breathe that in for a minute because that's what it comes down to with belonging, is that when you're truly with people where you can be yourself. And again, answer that question, who am I? That's when belonging really means something, the power behind it. And that's what helps you grow. But it's that facade that a lot of us are in where it's like, oh, we wanna be part of the A group or we wanna be part of that.
So we try to fit in or we're told we can't do a certain thing because it doesn't fly with the group. But then we're too afraid to say, well, okay, well then this group's not for me. And um, so I look at that and [00:47:00] say, if you feel comfortable with a group of people that you're at, and you're having those deep, meaningful conversations about who are you and where you wanna be instead of just the weather or what the kids are doing.
'cause I think I might shoot myself if I have another one of those conversations. Um, and, and again, there is a place for those. And I'm not saying that they're all bad, but it's just, if that's the only kind of conversations I'm having, then I'm not filled. And if you're in field hearing that and that resonates with you, that means that you are searching for that more.
And again, I have to say this, there are a lot of people. A lot of moms out there that are still in that , that mentality that they're not ready for it. And that's okay too. But if you are, and this is resonating to you, that's when you want to start looking for the people that are, and finding the group that's right for you.
'cause that's where you really do find true belonging in creating that and or finding, looking for it when you decide I wanna look for it. And it's not that you have to dismiss everyone around you, but it's that then you're filling your cup with those people where you do get to talk [00:48:00] about your passions and your dreams and you get the space for it to discover that.
'cause if you're out there saying, yeah, I want more, I want to do something with my life, I want to leave something behind. Any of those questions out there, you don't need answers, but you need the right group of people to talk to to help bring that out of you and support each other in it. 'cause it does get hard.
That's why even Melanie, like why we have these connections, because we get to have these conversations and say, okay, today was hard, but I did one thing so I'm not giving up. Yes. You just keep going. And then tomorrow, you know, it's a better day. So I'm gonna do five things, but I'm not stopping. Because the only thing that's gonna get your way is if you say you give up and take the easy way out because it is hard, it is easier to say, I'm done, I'm not, uh, I I'm not gonna do this easier.
And that's what it comes down to. But it's
Mel: actually not
Michelle: right. It's not because in the long run, like you say no to your health for so long, next thing you know, you're overweight, you're having heart problems. It, it's, it's harder down the line. You say no as a, as a [00:49:00] mom to the people around you. Like that happens a lot to first time moms and, and it is what it is because of the survival mechanism and wanting to take care of that.
But then you get on the other side, like that's why one of, one of the group's moms I work with are the elementary age moms because they're the point where they're out of the survival mode. They're all of a sudden now what. Like we have these kids, I wanna do something with them. But then I also want something I want more.
And dammit, you should have more. Excuse me. I don't know if I'm supposed to say up, but you might have to edit that.
Mel: It's all good. There's a box I can tick on. The thing that's besides, that's not a swear word. Anyways. It's all good.
Michelle: But that's what it comes down to is if you can answer, if you can say I want more.
And that's again the problem with no name, I want more. And so how do we do it? It's, I'm looking at that as it being a calling. Yeah, calling to get out there and do it. And the best, easiest, funnest way to do that is with other women who feel the same, who want to make the difference. Because then you [00:50:00] get resources, you get support, you get to be able to talk to this problem.
'cause I'm sorry, some of my friends are like, business. What? Yeah. I can't stand listening to that and that's okay. But I need the people who do want to have those conversations and do want to have those entrepreneur conversations and, and do more and support other people. So it's finding that group to support that dream.
You want the dream, you need the support to get there. Definitely.
Mel: I a hundred percent agree. And there's um, you know, there are ways. So
on our own, this is possible. And part of that is a mindset thing in that there's definitely a story that I tell myself or have and probably still do sometimes, and I know others do as well, that nobody else feels like I do right now. Nobody else feels like they need more connections or friends or, um, you know, someone else to talk to.
And [00:51:00] therefore I stop myself. Four
Michelle: people, just bring this one out there because I'm gonna keep cutting you off. Or the people who's like, oh, they have way too many friends. They don't need me. Exactly that. There's no one out there that needs, everyone else already has their friends. I, I'm not needed.
Mel: Exactly, and I think that story is really detrimental to all of us. And, and, and therefore we have to have the intention to shift that story and force ourselves to have some conversations with people and be vulnerable. Right. Be vulnerable because it might, maybe in the rare 1% circumstance, I just made that stat up by the way, but that, that person might be like, oh, actually I, I'm good.
I got enough friends. Most people won't say that, but if they did, hey, go to the next person. It's such a small percentage that are gonna say that, right? And, but it feels vulnerable to put ourselves out there. And so I just encourage people to, if there is someone that you think, I really think we could have a connection with, you know, like, just [00:52:00] go talk to them about the thing that you want.
Don't talk about the weather and whatever. Talk about what you wanna
Michelle: talk about. Well, the best way to which, which is usually in a podcast, but the best way I I love doing is that you know, that moms especially out there, like you see another person and they have a nice dress on, or they have a beautiful hat, or like all of a sudden you have these beautiful thoughts in your head.
Then you just let them walk by regardless. Like just start practicing getting those thoughts outta your head and, and. Most of the time it'll bring a smile to their face. And even if it's just that, it's the practice of being vulnerable and being your true self. Those beautiful thoughts, the more we start saying them aloud, yeah.
The more we start seeing 'em, the more we start sending that energy off to the people around us that they're gonna be, yeah, I wanna be part of that energy. I wanna be friends with you. And it just comes down to complimenting the other person. And when you start paying attention, those thoughts just start floating to you.
Like, I really like her dress. She looks great with that. Or, I really love the way she's doing that with her kid. You know how much people, women [00:53:00] don't take compliments, but we need to work on that. And just the more we give them to each other, we change the energy. Like, let's stop looking at like, what, what are they doing wrong with their kid?
Start looking at what they're doing right with their kid. What are they doing right with the way they are? And start pointing that out to people.
Mel: Exactly. Um, I wanna like give snaps to that, that way to do it. But, um, because you're right, and I think. I think complimenting is such a nice in because everybody is, as much as we'll be humble about it because we're trained to be, we like it, it feels good to be told that.
Um, and even better, like, so like depending on your relationship with that person in terms of like it's a stranger on the street or it's a mom that actually you see each other all the time because you're a pickup or whatever. Um, depending on that, that depth of relationship so far as the depth you can go, but people want to hear the real stuff.
So this weekend I really [00:54:00] practiced 'cause it was such a safe space of this, this community of positive psychology practitioners. I just started practicing, like telling people what I really did admire about them, which was deeper than like their clothes or their whatever. It was like, right. I really find it like I really admire the fact that you are.
So attentive to listening to everybody, or that you were able to share your story as a speaker in a way that most other people didn't go that deep. Or, you know, just sharing really those little things and then all of a sudden there's a much deeper connection right away.
Michelle: Right. I love how you just said practice, so mm-hmm.
Because, and but you put yourself in an environment where it's safe to do that. That's true. And, and, and again, that's why, that's why when I was saying like, you know, the, the general compliments to get started, and again, this is practice and then find those environments such as you put yourself in that you can start going thrive deep.
But again, let's, let's be [00:55:00] realistic here and say like, we don't wanna dive into the deep end right away. And this is being grateful. Practicing it, identifying it, it's a learned behavior with the negative concept that that's how we're trained. And so, I'm just, I just love that you said practice because it was just so like impacting yourself environment where you could
Mel: Yeah, it's totally a practice and honestly, one of the biggest things I got from this weekend is that practice, that ability to, I have a story that I tell myself for my whole entire life that I don't like small talk.
I'm not good at small talk. I will avoid it at all costs. Right? And therefore, I don't meet people in the same way that I could. And one because I, and I suppose there's a value in there under underlying all that, that it has to happen. Right? And this weekend was wonderful because I was able to, I get myself in it.
I had to work through this to get myself to the point, like second day on, I think probably, of [00:56:00] saying, what do you want most from this conference, Mel? That's not the information that I'm getting in my head, although I have a lot of tidbits that I'm gonna share on podcasts coming up. That's not what I really went there for.
I went there to feel, feel connected. And to build relationships even if they don't go beyond that weekend. Right? And so I did practice. I did practice. I saw people and I said, which one of these in this room do I feel most comfortable going up to? Not comfortable. Most comfortable. 'cause I was never comfortable.
And then just go and ask them something about themselves. 'cause as well as all that compliment is a great way to start. It's also about like, it's not about you
Michelle: listening. Listen,
Mel: just ask them a question and listen to the answer. Right? As soon as that started to flip in my head that I don't have to sound smart or, or anything, it doesn't matter because that person's focusing so much on themself anyways in a conversation that [00:57:00] they don't care what I have to say most people, right?
That if I just listen to what they say and when I'm stuck for anything to say, just in a. In a way that doesn't sound false, repeat it back to them. Like say what you heard or what you liked about what they heard. There you go. Conversation
Michelle: started, done. I love, um, one of my friends, Brenda Billing says, instead of feeling like you have to be interesting, be interested, I
Mel: know I have a card somewhere in my, somewhere over there, there's a card that says exactly that and it's my favorite little postcard because that is, and it's just a
Michelle: flip of it.
It's the same word. Don't be interesting, be interested, but get us perspective in how we look at these things and putting ourselves in those situations to do those things because it is, it is growth and it, and it is overwhelming to do these things and find the space where you feel comfortable do it.
Which is why I encourage all of you listeners, if any of this is resonating with you, to find that space where you feel comfortable to start the practice of doing these things. [00:58:00] And that's why community is so important because as much as we can say, we can read our self help book and, and work on some of the things, and yes, we can work on some of the things.
And a lot of it is going inward. And that does take time. But it's also that we need to do it together and listen to each other as we're going through it to realize that we're not alone in this. To keep going. Yeah. Because otherwise we're like, oh, well I'm the only one having this. I'm just gonna stop.
This is pointless. And so when you start to be seen and heard and see another list to others, you're like, oh, that's why we're doing this. That's their passion. They're gonna help me uncover, I'm interested in what they're doing. And you get you. And I loved how you said what, that's why it came up, is you're gonna see the possibilities.
And I love that you said the about the conferences, even if I don't go past this weekend. And I, that's why I feel like at the conference, like, oh, we're gonna stay in touch and we're gonna do these things. And then life happens. And actually, this year, last, this time last year, I was on a cruise in France with a wonderful group of travel agents that I got really close with on the trip and, and really haven't stayed as much in touch with them [00:59:00] as I would've liked to.
But what it did do was let me see possibilities that I didn't see before. And to make those connections and realize that even if these weren't the connections yet, I am capable of doing these things, and then I'm gonna be doing them more often because I see the reactions and the response and the possibilities.
And I did the same thing when I went to a conference. And, and, and again, you're, you gotta admit and just be wary that you're in the mood and, and in the vibe and, and everyone's there. That's okay because you are, like you said, it's practicing and that's what you were meant to do at that moment in time.
And whether some connections stay, some don't. It's okay. Yeah. You got an experience that you wouldn't have got another way.
Mel: Exactly. And relationships, you know, we always think of these more long-term relationship. A relationship is with anyone I have a relationship with. Like the person I, I pick up my parcel from the post office with, you know, relationship has all sorts of meaning to that word.
And, um, something, one of the phrases that is used in the [01:00:00] science and the positive psychology world is a high quality connection and a quite, and the more high quality con connections we can have in a day, the better our wellbeing will be. Right? Okay. And a high quality connection does not have to even be a deep, deep, meaningful conversation, although that is clearly a very high quality conation, like, right.
But it could be with a stranger, it could be with your next door neighbor. It could be, you know, it's not even someone that you're gonna see again necessarily, but it will better your wellbeing if you get more high quality connections in your day.
Michelle: And they, it could be just that smile from a compliment.
It's mutual, right? Yeah, totally. It does not have to be, but it's more those those con the the, when we think we're doing connecting, and I just wanna point this out, um, that when we think we're doing connecting and we're sitting there like, okay, well we got our mom friends. And the one thing I do notice sometimes with mom friends is that negative connection is the complaint fest.[01:01:00]
And at times when I've been in different groups, felt like I couldn't come, I couldn't say anything. 'cause I, at that moment int anything I wanted to complain about. And I just felt like, oh my gosh, I. And so to be weary of that in terms of is this a type of connection that speaks to me? Is this the type I actually want?
Is this actually making me feel better? Yeah. And sometimes we have to remove ourselves from some of those because they're not, and that's where the hard part comes in, is having different conversations, setting up the boundaries and things. When you decide the things that you want and the things that you're willing to say no to now, because you realize, yes, I do deserve some of the things.
And by saying no to people you would've always said yes to before. 'cause you're people pleasing. Yeah. That's when the boundaries start to come into play. And that's where the hardness comes into play and that's where the support and talking to other people who are doing the same thing as you helps you to keep moving forward to your dream.
Yeah. Because yes, you're gonna have to start saying no to things to say yes to you, but it's not natural things you even wanna say yes to in the first place. It's just having the guts to [01:02:00] have those conversations and say, yeah, I'm done doing that. I'm not gonna be the pushover anymore. I'm going to say yes to me instead of saying yes to all these demands that I didn't even wanna do in the first place.
Yeah. And picking the ones you actually do wanna do. And that's where the time comes into play where you say, I'm so busy, busy, busy. You say yes to things you wanna say yes to. Yeah. I mean, it's not that I give up my kids' activities, I still do TaeKwonDo with my son. I was coaching my daughter's soccer team.
It's, it's not that we say no to the activities, we say yes to the ones we wanna say yes to, and we feel actually make a deeper connection with our kids rather than, oh, well I have to be the room mother even though I didn't want to, or whatever it is that you felt you got stuck doing. Yeah. And so finding the ones that you enjoy doing and then making sure you get to sign up for those when they come around, being that in your schedule, it's like, I'm gonna make sure I get say yes to that before anyone else does, because that's what I want to do.
And that's what this is all about, is figuring out those things we wanna say yes to. But then we have to have those hard [01:03:00] conversations and those boundaries as we say. No. And that's why we need community.
Mel: A hundred percent. I love, uh, all of that and I love that you brought it back to community. And so what's coming to mind as we, uh, slowly are gonna start to wind down is that as people, so we've been talking about how people can go and find, you know, we can do this anywhere in our life.
We can do it with the strangers, we can do it with the, you know, the moms we might have run into a few times. We can, we can try to build those connections on our own and we will, and it will take time. And there's other ways to feel connections that are deeper right now. And one of them is through coaching, as you and I both know, and I, and along that line, the other is to, is to find a community that's already there and people are there for, for that reason.
So on that note, tell us a little bit about your business and how people could connect in with it.
Michelle: So my business is all about connection, as you know, it's, it's called Connecting Mamas. And so my dream, my big audacious [01:04:00] dream is to make a community where women feel connected in being themselves. My whole thing is I love to run women's circles, and we've been doing them once a month through Workshop for Moms
But it's about bringing community together. And even in a Zoom room, people will be like, you can have, you can have community in an our Zoom room. Yes, we can have deeper connections than we could have in-person watching the kids' soccer game or whatever, just because they're so superficial. And it's about, again, it comes down to intention.
So for me, right now, some of the things I'm offering are one-on-one coaching. I'm working towards offering the group classes as well, but I'm also, my whole vision is behind the. Women's circle. And again, what does a circle mean? 'cause it, it seems so like out there, right? And I know some people just might not have any idea what that is.
And really what happens in the zoom room is actually with the technology now I can actually put you guys into a circle, literally. But it's, part of it is that you're [01:05:00] coming to be seen and heard. And one of the things that we do not do in the circle is give any feedback or advice. It's all about just seeing and witnessing each other and the power of connection that comes from that.
And really learning how to listen again is magical. 'cause then we're able to transfer that to our kids when we realize that our kids don't actually want us to solve their problems. But they do want us to listen to their problems. And yes, I'm buddying my tongue as my daughter's talking. I'm like, t she doesn't want me to solve it.
I then I will ask, do you want me to help you with that? Do you just want me to listen and, and give her choices rather than jump in again. But that's what it, it comes down to is we need to practice that with each other. Again, it's all practice and doing that. So if you guys want to connect me that it's connecting mamas.com and you can find that information there.
But honestly, if any of this resonates, find me out. But really, I just wanna encourage you to find a good like minded my to want to grow because I've been around moms that don't, [01:06:00] and it really does. When you want to do that and you don't have anyone else to talk to about it, really brings you back down to where you were and you might not get back up from it.
And I'm not saying you need to get rid of all your friends at all, it's just you don't wanna talk to them about those things right now till they're ready. And we don't need to put all that on them. I mean, just because you're ready doesn't mean that they are. And I've learned that the hard way as well.
And so it's more just find the people that are at the space unit and find the conversations you need to have to make sure you don't stop growing. And that's the biggest key is find that community. And then do the things that your friends wanna do and, and do that differently. But just know your intention and to make sure you have an outlet so you don't stop your dreams.
Mel: Amazing. I absolutely love what you are building there and I highly encourage people to check it out and to join these circles. I think as you say, that's a really magical space. Magical to simply be listened to. And it sounds like such a simple thing, but I [01:07:00] bet you there's a lot of listeners out there who were in the place that I was a couple of years ago where I had nobody that listened in my life.
That's how it felt. Right? Because, because I, we just, just in the season of my life that at the dinner table, when I tried to cut talk to my husband, my kid would constantly interrupt. 'cause he thought that, like that, that he didn't understand how conversations worked yet, basically. Um, And, and, and therefore, you know, sometimes situations like that or, or even more complex, can leave us in a space where actually there is, there's nobody in our, our life at the moment that we can naturally talk about this stuff to.
And it is important, like I've said, um, in previous podcasts, to find that person who we know will add, especially if you start talking about dreams and ambitions, who will be that person that will, will cheer you on no matter what you
Michelle: say ridiculous. And, and not tell you that that's impossible. Ridiculous.
Right. And think you're ridiculous. Exactly. Exactly. But
Mel: [01:08:00] the person like don't tell, don't tell those people right now. Right. Connection. Sure. But that's not the person right now in this moment. Maybe in the future it will be, who knows? But find that person who is so, if that's not in your life naturally right now, then there are some amazing ways, both through your work and mine to connect to.
With someone who you know, will cheer, will cheer
Michelle: you on. I just wanna, right before we end, I just wanna touch on the word vulnerability. Hmm. Because it's such an important word, but we feel like we need to be vulnerable with everyone. That is not true. Hmm. Especially when you're starting out being vulnerable.
You do need to be selective because it is hard work and you wanna be selective with who you choose to be vulnerable with and test it out slowly. And again, it's a dance, it's not like, let me just fill out my whole life and that they better listen. That's not how it works. And, and you need, like, as you're looking for those right people, it's testing that and can they, can they keep my secrets?
Can they, can they listen to these [01:09:00] things? Can they do these things? Because people will show you who they are when you give them the space and time. So vulnerability is not something that just happens. We need to work at it, and we need to work at being able to do it and also give it back to that person as well.
And
Mel: practice. Right? Just practice. Um, vulnerability is a practice thing. And you know, the more I do it, the more, actually I don't care as much about, uh, what the other person, if they did come back and say, um, the wrong thing. I, I don't take offense to it 'cause I've done so much inner work. Right. Um, and I practice that vulnerability over a long period of time with people that I know will respond in a way that is respectful and we've created a safe space together in order to do that.
'cause vulnerability requires a safe, a safe space.
Michelle: So, , look for that safe space before you say, I'm gonna be vulnerable with this person. Yeah, exactly.
Mel: So amazing. So community is definitely a focus of this conversation and, and meaning [01:10:00] and dreams and all of the amazing things you're doing. Uh, I. I find very admirable, Michelle, that you are.
Thank you. We haven't actually spoken in a little while and I can see your confidence has shifted quite a bit and that's just such a nice, nice thing to see. So,
Michelle: well, I do have to say, since we last talked, I am a published author with my daughter, woo hoo. And just this, the idea we're, I mean we're in chapter anthology, but doing stuff with your kids when you are the role model, then they start to see and they wanna do some of stuff.
So both my daughter and son have spoken in summits and it's, and it's getting that out there and being the role model you want. So they are inspired to do their own thing and how they want to do it and just offering that to them. And that's what it all comes down to. Figuring out what you want to help them find what they want.
And that's what we all want. We want our kids to be happy, healthy adults, but we gotta be them.
Mel: Do.
Amazing. Thank you so much for joining us today, Michelle.
Michelle: Thank you for having me.
Oh, it's so good to chat with Michelle. DeKeyser isn't [01:11:00] it such a great, amazing story that she has and how she's turning it into such a powerful way to support. Women moms and community
And I hope you will go check out her work. She is such a fascinating woman who is truly. Going out there and achieving her big audacious dream, which I love because her dream is to work with moms. Just like you. And bring them together.
So a few things she mentioned there were workshops for moms, have a little search on Facebook. There is a page N group that you can join. And they have so many free resources. Of talks that you can join and so much more do go check them out. Especially the, the woman circles that Michelle is running on there. Again, it's totally free. So, what's the risk, right? And you [01:12:00] can connect with Michelle [email protected]. Or connecting mamas on Facebook, please do go and check her out and say hello and let her know that you listened to. Her incredible story here on permission to be human the podcast [01:13:00] [01:14:00]
